.525 Leadpipes?
- dembones
- Posts: 90
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
There are fewer options available, but wondering what .525 leadpipes people are liking, and why?
I'm probably most interested in those for small shank mouthpieces. Brass Ark, M/K Drawing are making them, anyone tried them? Or others?
I'm probably most interested in those for small shank mouthpieces. Brass Ark, M/K Drawing are making them, anyone tried them? Or others?
- Thrawn22
- Posts: 1436
- Joined: Sep 06, 2018
I'm not a big fan of Bach trombones, but man do their leadpipes sound good in my Conns. My Conn 2547 slide came with 3 pipes (x,t, and r i believe). The x is the large shank pipe which for me ate butt. The other 2 blew ok but i didn't notice much difference between them. I hot a Bach 36 pipe and man what a difference. Tone was more focused and overall it really centered things up. I've always used Bach 50 pipes for bass and i have Bach 36 pipes that are fitted for my .500 bore horns.
- Matt_K
- Posts: 4809
- Joined: Mar 21, 2018
I actually had the opposite experience from Thrawn. I use a Conn X on my 525/547 on my Shires if I want a large shank and a Conn 52H pipe if I want a small shank. With an XT104N/E/E8 or XT104N/E/E4. I'd get an E5 but I prefer the large shank for classical stuff and the E8, especially the new ones Doug came up with recently, are essentially magical for me.
- Kdanielsen
- Posts: 609
- Joined: Jul 28, 2019
I have one 525 leadpipe and I don't like it (Edwards 2). It's what came with my Edwards 525 slide.
I'm planning on replacing it with something from Brass Ark. Not sure if I'll go Conn or Bach. The eventual goal is to use the Edwards handslide I have with a very old Conn bell section (80H SPEC) that doesn't have a slide.
I'm planning on replacing it with something from Brass Ark. Not sure if I'll go Conn or Bach. The eventual goal is to use the Edwards handslide I have with a very old Conn bell section (80H SPEC) that doesn't have a slide.
- MrHCinDE
- Posts: 1039
- Joined: Jul 01, 2018
I use the Conn X pipe with my SL2525 and Elkhart 8h bell section and quite like it for when I want a slightly more open feel with a large shank mouthpiece. I‘m not sure I get the full benefit of a medium-bore slide with that setup but it‘s useful as an option if I don’t have a clue what I’ll be playing and don‘t want to take two slides.
The H and T small shank pipes that also came with the SL2525 are ok but I wasn‘t entirely satisfied so got an M/K sterling silver pipe (Conn style) as well. Since I got the M/K pipe I‘ve hardly touched the other small shank pipes. I like the stability at loud volume which still allows the 8h colour to come through without getting too zippy. Maybe the T had a slightly more secure upper register and the H more room to lip in the tuning but overall the M/K is my go-to option.
The H and T small shank pipes that also came with the SL2525 are ok but I wasn‘t entirely satisfied so got an M/K sterling silver pipe (Conn style) as well. Since I got the M/K pipe I‘ve hardly touched the other small shank pipes. I like the stability at loud volume which still allows the 8h colour to come through without getting too zippy. Maybe the T had a slightly more secure upper register and the H more room to lip in the tuning but overall the M/K is my go-to option.
- dukesboneman
- Posts: 935
- Joined: Apr 02, 2018
I have an Edwards #2 in my Mount Vernon 36.
It really opened up the horn
I had a Tech cut the threads off
It really opened up the horn
I had a Tech cut the threads off
- Matt_K
- Posts: 4809
- Joined: Mar 21, 2018
[quote="dukesboneman"]I have an Edwards #2 in my Mount Vernon 36.
It really opened up the horn
I had a Tech cut the threads off[/quote]
Another good option is to file down the threads so it still fits and the "ring" just sits on top of the receiver. That way the leadpipe doesn't come out easily, as it may without soldering, but you can still remove it if you like.
It really opened up the horn
I had a Tech cut the threads off[/quote]
Another good option is to file down the threads so it still fits and the "ring" just sits on top of the receiver. That way the leadpipe doesn't come out easily, as it may without soldering, but you can still remove it if you like.
- dembones
- Posts: 90
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
Thanks all for the feedback.
I recently acquired a new Butler C8 .525 horn. It is fantastic, but that is for another thread.
It came with an Edwards #3 pipe. I don't have anything to compare it to, so wondering if I would like a #2 even more, or maybe one of M/K Drawing's Bach or Conn style pipes.
Does anyone have experience with the M/K pipes, and in broad terms how the Bach/Conn style pipes play, and how they differ? Is the material as much of a consideration as B vs. C?
I recently acquired a new Butler C8 .525 horn. It is fantastic, but that is for another thread.
It came with an Edwards #3 pipe. I don't have anything to compare it to, so wondering if I would like a #2 even more, or maybe one of M/K Drawing's Bach or Conn style pipes.
Does anyone have experience with the M/K pipes, and in broad terms how the Bach/Conn style pipes play, and how they differ? Is the material as much of a consideration as B vs. C?
- Matt_K
- Posts: 4809
- Joined: Mar 21, 2018
[quote="dembones"]Thanks all for the feedback.
I recently acquired a new Butler C8 .525 horn. It is fantastic, but that is for another thread.
It came with an Edwards #3 pipe. I don't have anything to compare it to, so wondering if I would like a #2 even more, or maybe one of M/K Drawing's Bach or Conn style pipes.
Does anyone have experience with the M/K pipes, and in broad terms how the Bach/Conn style pipes play, and how they differ? Is the material as much of a consideration as B vs. C?[/quote]
Generally, Shires/Edwards pipes the higher numbers are closer to Conn and lower numbers are closer to Bach pipes. I personally find material to be less important than taper, but to be different enough it's worth considering when making a purchase. I tend to prefer lower numbers for horns that have one piece bells and higher numbers for two piece bells. You should probably contact butler about what they recommend. If they put a 3 in it, it's possible it's because they think it works better on that horn, all things considered, than other pipes which would make sense given carbon fiber is a lot different than brass.
I recently acquired a new Butler C8 .525 horn. It is fantastic, but that is for another thread.
It came with an Edwards #3 pipe. I don't have anything to compare it to, so wondering if I would like a #2 even more, or maybe one of M/K Drawing's Bach or Conn style pipes.
Does anyone have experience with the M/K pipes, and in broad terms how the Bach/Conn style pipes play, and how they differ? Is the material as much of a consideration as B vs. C?[/quote]
Generally, Shires/Edwards pipes the higher numbers are closer to Conn and lower numbers are closer to Bach pipes. I personally find material to be less important than taper, but to be different enough it's worth considering when making a purchase. I tend to prefer lower numbers for horns that have one piece bells and higher numbers for two piece bells. You should probably contact butler about what they recommend. If they put a 3 in it, it's possible it's because they think it works better on that horn, all things considered, than other pipes which would make sense given carbon fiber is a lot different than brass.
- dembones
- Posts: 90
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
[quote="Matt K"]
Generally, Shires/Edwards pipes the higher numbers are closer to Conn and lower numbers are closer to Bach pipes. I personally find material to be less important than taper, but to be different enough it's worth considering when making a purchase. I tend to prefer lower numbers for horns that have one piece bells and higher numbers for two piece bells. You should probably contact butler about what they recommend. If they put a 3 in it, it's possible it's because they think it works better on that horn, all things considered, than other pipes which would make sense given carbon fiber is a lot different than brass.[/quote]
That is great info -- thank you, Matt.
Generally, Shires/Edwards pipes the higher numbers are closer to Conn and lower numbers are closer to Bach pipes. I personally find material to be less important than taper, but to be different enough it's worth considering when making a purchase. I tend to prefer lower numbers for horns that have one piece bells and higher numbers for two piece bells. You should probably contact butler about what they recommend. If they put a 3 in it, it's possible it's because they think it works better on that horn, all things considered, than other pipes which would make sense given carbon fiber is a lot different than brass.[/quote]
That is great info -- thank you, Matt.
- MrHCinDE
- Posts: 1039
- Joined: Jul 01, 2018
Maybe this is also of interest, you could try out the Bach and Conn style in one or more material from M/K drawing:
[url]https://www.mkdrawing.com/trial-policy/
(Other than being very satisfied with one of their leadpipes as I wrote in an earlier post, I have no connection with M/K drawing!)
(Other than being very satisfied with one of their leadpipes as I wrote in an earlier post, I have no connection with M/K drawing!)
- PhilE
- Posts: 97
- Joined: Apr 26, 2018
Top of my list are the Brass Ark Brad Close MV36 and the Brasslab T525 STD.
- dukesboneman
- Posts: 935
- Joined: Apr 02, 2018
Dembones,
The Edwards #3 pipe , for me, is way too open.
#1 - too tight
Kind of like Goldilocks and the 3 bears
#2 is just right
The Edwards #3 pipe , for me, is way too open.
#1 - too tight
Kind of like Goldilocks and the 3 bears
#2 is just right
- Matt_K
- Posts: 4809
- Joined: Mar 21, 2018
AFAIK, Edwards doesn't do inbetween sizes but Shires does. Or at leas they used to. Newell Sheridan liked to stock 1.5s, especially for bases. I've also seen 1 1/38 and 2 1/8 sizes. So if you find 1/3 to be too extreme in any direction and have some cash to burn, the '.5' Shires are good pipes to try. 2 is pretty safe generally. The Shires Sauer pipes are evidently closer to the 2.5 size as well. I tried one on a RS horn and loved it back in... 2014(?) but I acquired one two years ago and hated it in my 525/547 slide. There are numerous differences between my horn and the RS horn though.
- dembones
- Posts: 90
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
[quote="dukesboneman"]Dembones,
The Edwards #3 pipe , for me, is way too open.
#1 - too tight
Kind of like Goldilocks and the 3 bears
#2 is just right[/quote]
On further examination I think the one that came with my Butler is an Edwards #2 - three bumpy ridges with two grooves - right?
It plays really well, so I may just leave it alone. I'm kind of a compulsive tweaker, though...
The Edwards #3 pipe , for me, is way too open.
#1 - too tight
Kind of like Goldilocks and the 3 bears
#2 is just right[/quote]
On further examination I think the one that came with my Butler is an Edwards #2 - three bumpy ridges with two grooves - right?
It plays really well, so I may just leave it alone. I'm kind of a compulsive tweaker, though...
- Matt_K
- Posts: 4809
- Joined: Mar 21, 2018
Yeah:
One Groove + Two Ridges = T1 or B1 (smallest)
Two Grooves + Three Ridges = T2 or B2
Three Grooves + Four Ridges = T3 or B3 (largest)
#2 from my understanding is "usually" the one that most players go with on boutique horns. If you want it to feel little "broader" you might go a 2.5 or 3 and if you want it to be a little "clearer" you might go 1 or 1.5. For a commercial horn, I'd probably stick to yellow brass.
One Groove + Two Ridges = T1 or B1 (smallest)
Two Grooves + Three Ridges = T2 or B2
Three Grooves + Four Ridges = T3 or B3 (largest)
#2 from my understanding is "usually" the one that most players go with on boutique horns. If you want it to feel little "broader" you might go a 2.5 or 3 and if you want it to be a little "clearer" you might go 1 or 1.5. For a commercial horn, I'd probably stick to yellow brass.
- dembones
- Posts: 90
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
[quote="Matt K"]Yeah:
One Groove + Two Ridges = T1 or B1 (smallest)
Two Grooves + Three Ridges = T2 or B2
Three Grooves + Four Ridges = T3 or B3 (largest)
#2 from my understanding is "usually" the one that most players go with on boutique horns. If you want it to feel little "broader" you might go a 2.5 or 3 and if you want it to be a little "clearer" you might go 1 or 1.5. For a commercial horn, I'd probably stick to yellow brass.[/quote]
Great, thanks Matt.
One Groove + Two Ridges = T1 or B1 (smallest)
Two Grooves + Three Ridges = T2 or B2
Three Grooves + Four Ridges = T3 or B3 (largest)
#2 from my understanding is "usually" the one that most players go with on boutique horns. If you want it to feel little "broader" you might go a 2.5 or 3 and if you want it to be a little "clearer" you might go 1 or 1.5. For a commercial horn, I'd probably stick to yellow brass.[/quote]
Great, thanks Matt.
- heinzgries
- Posts: 250
- Joined: Apr 24, 2018
Brassark MV 36 copper is great