DIY Bell Removal

Matt_K · by **Matt_K** » 2021-08-21 8:46 a.m.

Got a pbone and a king tempo that I’m going to merge together per the pbone thread a few weeks ago. Just need to remove the bell and I thought I’d give it a go myself. I’ve got a small torch, anyone have instructions on how to remove a bell from the braces? From what I gather, I hear it up until it fluid and comes off right?

BGuttman · by **BGuttman** » 2021-08-21 9:03 a.m.

There are a couple of YouTube videos from Brass and Woodwind Shop showing how to desolder joints. You have to heat slowly moving the torch to keep the heat even. Especially on the large flange for the bell brace. There's also a guy in Mississippi -- I think his name is Wes Lee.

Note: don't try to solder the plastic bell. Doesn't work at all ;) :tongue:

Crazy4Tbone86 · by **Crazy4Tbone86** » 2021-08-23 3:28 p.m.

Wait just a minute! You are combining some type of a plastic component with a brass component? Please explain exactly what you are doing. Sounds like it could turn out to be a molten plastic mess or an epoxy nightmare.

Matt_K · by **Matt_K** » 2021-08-23 9:14 p.m.

Haha yeah so there was some discussion about the pbone not too long ago and I contended that the bell itself probably wasn’t too bad but the rest of the horn probably was holding it back. So I procured a pbone and I have a king tempo I’m going to mount the bell on. I didn’t have time to remove the tempo bell this weekend. Not sure how I’ll mount but I guess I could do epoxy. I was thinking I might just do a zip tie initially or something so I didn’t have to glue it since getting that apart is probably going to be borderline impossible !

Posaunus · by **Posaunus** » 2021-08-23 9:41 p.m.

Matt,

The pBone ABS bell is "OK" at best.

But it is certainly lighter than a brass bell.

I presume your objective is to create a lightweight trombone just to have fun with?

This hybrid will certainly play better than a pBone, since you will have a somewhat decent lead pipe and can use the mouthpiece of your choice.

Can't you get the Tempo slide tenon to somehow mate with the the entire pBone bell section?

timothy42b · by **timothy42b** » 2021-08-24 7:29 a.m.

The pBone receiver connection is not a tenon type, it's sort of a space between two cylinders that the slide goes into. He's going to have to modify the plastic somehow to make that fit.

Maybe a 3D print job?

timothy42b · by **timothy42b** » 2021-08-24 7:29 a.m.

Or when all else fails, call for Mr. Fernco.

Matt_K · by **Matt_K** » 2021-08-24 7:33 a.m.

Oh yeah the purpose of this is absolutely nothing more than my own amusement. Although if I ended up with a lighter weight beater horn that’d be great. The tuning slide receiver is slightly larger in the pbone so I think I’ll just seal it up with some Teflon tape since I never move my tuning slide anyway.

Harpcat · by **Harpcat** » 2021-08-24 2:23 p.m.

I sent my '65 King 3B to Dave Butler of Butler Trombones and he replaced the bell with a carbon fiber one. Also, replaced the outer slide with a carbon fiber one. I love it! Amazingly, it still has that iconic 3B sound that many of us dig.

All the best on your journey to the "perfect" trombone!

Jay

brassmedic · by **brassmedic** » 2021-08-25 6:06 a.m.

I have my grandfather's axe. My father replaced the head. I replaced the handle.

BGuttman · by **BGuttman** » 2021-08-25 6:23 a.m.

Matt is just trying to do an experiment -- to see if the plastic bell from a pBone grafted to a brass trombone still sounds like a pBone.

No doubt a carbon fiber bell would sound better (and be a lot more costly). That is a permanent solution to a weight problem. But it's not what Matt is after.

harrisonreed · by **harrisonreed** » 2021-08-25 9:24 a.m.

The phone sounds pretty good between low F2 and F4. It sounds bad once you start trying to string notes together, because the slide is really bad. It also goes really flat in the upper register, probably because of something to do with the slide as well, maybe the "leadpipe". I wouldn't be surprised if it ended up sounding great, with the bell mounted to real hardware.

Crazy4Tbone86 · by **Crazy4Tbone86** » 2021-08-26 9:14 p.m.

[quote="timothy42b"]Or when all else fails, call for Mr. Fernco.[/quote]

Are you referring to that water-activated tape? That's not a bad idea.

timothy42b · by **timothy42b** » 2021-08-27 7:32 a.m.

[quote="Crazy4Tbone86"]<QUOTE author="timothy42b" post_id="155725" time="1629804565" user_id="211">
Or when all else fails, call for Mr. Fernco.[/quote]

Are you referring to that water-activated tape? That's not a bad idea.
</QUOTE>

Fernco is a brand name that has come to be the term most people use for a type of plumbing connector. The more generic term is probably No-Hub or flexible coupling.

<LINK_TEXT text="https://www.amazon.com/EVERCONNECT-4824 ... 6034&psc=1">https://www.amazon.com/EVERCONNECT-4824-Flexible-Coupling-Stainless/dp/B00HZSD7JQ/ref=asc_df_B00HZSD7JQ/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=241941495556&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=13143715651311493766&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9010229&hvtargid=pla-469893886034&psc=1</LINK_TEXT>

WGWTR180 · by **WGWTR180** » 2021-08-27 7:40 a.m.

Whatever you decide to do please post a video or some pics for our amusement.

Matt_K · by **Matt_K** » 2021-08-27 9:12 a.m.

100%! Fingers crossed, I might actually have time to get that bell mounted this weekend. BTW, the horn I'll be putting it on is actually not a tempo; it's a 605F so I'll be able to report on how good the F side is too because that's definitely something that is worth knowing.

Crazy4Tbone86 · by **Crazy4Tbone86** » 2021-08-27 10:34 a.m.

[quote="timothy42b"]<QUOTE author="Crazy4Tbone86" post_id="155990" time="1630026879" user_id="8392">

Are you referring to that water-activated tape? That's not a bad idea.[/quote]

Fernco is a brand name that has come to be the term most people use for a type of plumbing connector. The more generic term is probably No-Hub or flexible coupling.

<LINK_TEXT text="https://www.amazon.com/EVERCONNECT-4824 ... 6034&psc=1">https://www.amazon.com/EVERCONNECT-4824-Flexible-Coupling-Stainless/dp/B00HZSD7JQ/ref=asc_df_B00HZSD7JQ/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=241941495556&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=13143715651311493766&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9010229&hvtargid=pla-469893886034&psc=1</LINK_TEXT>
</QUOTE>

Actually, I was thinking of a tape to close the gap between the smaller brass component and the larger P-bone bell stem. If planned and executed well, the transition between the components could like rather nice. I went to the Fernco website and found this:

https://www.fernco.com/plumbing/pow-r-repair/pow-r-wrap

Matt_K · by **Matt_K** » 2021-08-27 12:06 p.m.

I was planning on using plain ol' plumbers tape. Although it occurs to me that I might be able to have a tech swap out the leg for me for not very much money that is exactly the right diameter.

Any techs up to the challenge? I can send you the pBone tuning slide and my spare King 605 tuning slide and you can see if you have a tube the right diameter to put on the bell side? Its not much bigger. I'd say maybe 1mm eyeballing it. But I don't have a pair of calipers. Probably could check with the local shop here but I ask for that they are going to seriously scratch their heads lol

kapkarl · by **kapkarl** » 2021-11-03 9:28 a.m.

Did you ever get results on this? Or did it get posted to a new thread I haven't seen? I'm a fan of experiments.

Matt_K · by **Matt_K** » 2021-11-03 11:08 a.m.

Almost, I found a set of parts that would work perfectly but I forgot to follow up with the person I was buying them from... I'll have to follow up with them to get those. As soon as I get that I could do it the same day!

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DIY Bell Removal