Hammond 12M

Arendsdale · by **Arendsdale** » 2021-09-02 12:55 a.m.

Hi all! Right now, I alternate between using a Bach 5GS and a Helleberg 5E. At times, the 5GS feels slightly too small, and the Helleberg seems slightly too large. I was looking at potentially going with a Hammond 12M, and the dimensions seem to be just a tad larger than the 5GS. I’ve also got a 12XL and despite it being so deep, I really like how it plays. Any thoughts are appreciated!

Burgerbob · by **Burgerbob** » 2021-09-02 1:40 a.m.

I'd probably try a 12ML first. It's a little shallower than the average 5G. The M I think would be pretty shallow, maybe more so than a 5GS.

Tbone00 · by **Tbone00** » 2021-09-02 5:15 a.m.

If you like bach mpc you can try a 5gl which is between the 5gs and the 5g

Arendsdale · by **Arendsdale** » 2021-09-02 7:13 a.m.

[quote="Burgerbob"]I'd probably try a 12ML first. It's a little shallower than the average 5G. The M I think would be pretty shallow, maybe more so than a 5GS.[/quote]

I was also thinking of this size but according to the Hammond and Bach specs, the 12M is a little deeper and has a slightly larger rim than the 5GS.

Arendsdale · by **Arendsdale** » 2021-09-02 7:14 a.m.

[quote="Tbone00"]If you like bach mpc you can try a 5gl which is between the 5gs and the 5g[/quote]

I had forgotten about that model! It might be worth a try, but the rim size is the same as the 5GS, so I’m worried it’ll be a bit to small as well.

BGuttman · by **BGuttman** » 2021-09-02 7:25 a.m.

Hammond 12 size is the same as Bach 5G. If 5G is too small, look at Hammond 11 size (about the same as Bach 4G).

Arendsdale · by **Arendsdale** » 2021-09-02 7:55 a.m.

[quote="BGuttman"]Hammond 12 size is the same as Bach 5G. If 5G is too small, look at Hammond 11 size (about the same as Bach 4G).[/quote]

I do have a 12XL from a while back, and I like how that feels rim wise, it’s just way to deep!

Tbone00 · by **Tbone00** » 2021-09-02 10:03 a.m.

[quote="BGuttman"]Hammond 12 size is the same as Bach 5G. If 5G is too small, look at Hammond 11 size (about the same as Bach 4G).[/quote]
I have also tried a 12ML and a 5g and the 12ML rim feels bigger in my lips than a 5g.

Arendsdale · by **Arendsdale** » 2021-09-02 11:03 a.m.

[quote="Tbone00"]<QUOTE author="BGuttman" post_id="156548" time="1630581912" user_id="53">
Hammond 12 size is the same as Bach 5G. If 5G is too small, look at Hammond 11 size (about the same as Bach 4G).[/quote]
I have also tried a 12ML and a 5g and the 12ML rim feels bigger in my lips than a 5g.
</QUOTE>

Yeah, according to the different specs the Hammond 12 series are about .01 inches larger in diameter than the Bach 5s

FEWeathers · by **FEWeathers** » 2021-09-02 7:38 p.m.

Cup-wise, the 12M has a V-shaped cup that would be an E- depth on the Elliot scale. It's shallower than the Bach 5GS, with no shoulders transitioning into the throat. So, 6 1/2 AL depth, but a true funnel shape.

JoeAumann · by **JoeAumann** » 2021-09-17 1:36 a.m.

[quote="Burgerbob"]I'd probably try a 12ML first. It's a little shallower than the average 5G. The M I think would be pretty shallow, maybe more so than a 5GS.[/quote]

I think this is good advice.

tbonesullivan · by **tbonesullivan** » 2021-09-17 11:04 a.m.

I play on an 11ML with my .525 Bore Yamaha, and a large shank 11ML and 11L with various trombones. The ML is really a great piece, and on a small shank, it's pretty close to a 6 1/2 AL in terms of feel.

The Large Shank 11ML is like a 4G rim with a 5G cup, but the cup is a bit more "V" shaped so it plays a bit more compact. The 11L is like a nice 4G, and I found it worked well with Euphonium as well as Trombone. I haven't picked up an 11XL.. yet.

The Helleberg 5E looks pretty huge inside, that classic deep funnel shape, and maybe even larger than the Hammond XL cup.

TexasTBone · by **TexasTBone** » 2021-09-28 9:11 p.m.

I really like the way the 12M feels on my face, and it has a much more natural playability. I ended up switching back to my Wick 5ABL because the V-shaped cup of the Hammond was a bit too bright for what I wanted in my sound. I think it's probably a good fit for commercial stuff.

MalecHeermans · by **MalecHeermans** » 2021-10-07 10:39 p.m.

The M is quite shallow. The ML is more in line with a general use piece.

Bonedisorder · by **Bonedisorder** » 2021-10-11 11:00 a.m.

For me I just have to put it in the horn and play it. I jump between the ML and L cups on my large bore set up and play an M cup on small bore.

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Hammond 12M