Need recommendations for a medium bore f/attach horn
- stjones
- Posts: 30
- Joined: Aug 08, 2018
After looking for some time for a 3b plus with f/attach, I found one. I played a straight 3B with a silver bell for 30+ years and developed a great fondness for the slide and the horn's response. Then I started trying other horns, which I don't regret. But I missed the 3B and recently managed to get a 3b plus with f/attach. It's great. Unfortunately, in the intervening years I've developed arthritis in my hands and the 3b plus trigger set up is painful. I know there are things like the Sheridan grip and the Neotech, but they don't do the trick. I have a 36b which doesn't have the trigger arrangement that the 3b does; it's an excellent horn, and it doesn't hurt my left hand. But it doesn't play like a 3B. There's a wonderful Dylan song called The Debutante, I think, in which Dylan is breaking up with a girl friend because he's found someone else. He says: "You know what I need, but she knows what I want." I need a horn like the 36b with a free standing trigger, but I want a small or medium bore horn with an f attach that plays like a 3B.
Suggestions?
BTW, if you'd be interested in a cosmetically challenged but really good playing 3B plus from the 80s with an unusually good King slide and excellent valve, stjones at umbc dot edu. I don't want to sell it, but it just isn't working for me.
Stephen
Suggestions?
BTW, if you'd be interested in a cosmetically challenged but really good playing 3B plus from the 80s with an unusually good King slide and excellent valve, stjones at umbc dot edu. I don't want to sell it, but it just isn't working for me.
Stephen
- afugate
- Posts: 671
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
[quote="stjones"]After looking for some time for a 3b plus with f/attach, I found one. I played a straight 3B with a silver bell for 30+ years and developed a great fondness for the slide and the horn's response. Then I started trying other horns, which I don't regret. But I missed the 3B and recently managed to get a 3b plus with f/attach. It's great. Unfortunately, in the intervening years I've developed arthritis in my hands and the 3b plus trigger set up is painful. I know there are things like the Sheridan grip and the Neotech, but they don't do the trick. I have a 36b which doesn't have the trigger arrangement that the 3b does; it's an excellent horn, and it doesn't hurt my left hand. But it doesn't play like a 3B. There's a wonderful Dylan song called The Debutante, I think, in which Dylan is breaking up with a girl friend because he's found someone else. He says: "You know what I need, but she knows what I want." I need a horn like the 36b with a free standing trigger, but I want a small or medium bore horn with an f attach that plays like a 3B.
Suggestions?[/quote]
Find a competent tech to replace the trigger setup to your liking. There are several competent techs on the trombonechat. I'd completely trust someone like Eric Edwards (boneartz) to do that work!
--Andy in OKC
Suggestions?[/quote]
Find a competent tech to replace the trigger setup to your liking. There are several competent techs on the trombonechat. I'd completely trust someone like Eric Edwards (boneartz) to do that work!
--Andy in OKC
- BGuttman
- Posts: 7368
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
See if you can find a Benge 175F. Made by King, but a little more symphonic than the King line. Same bore as the 3B+F.
If you can find one, the Yamaha 356.
I have a Reynolds Medalist that would fill the bill (no, it's not for sale right now).
Unfortunately many of the small bores with F are like your 3B+F with the trigger behind the bell brace (which I prefer just because it's easier to hold). Note that most of the grip aids work in the opposite direction of what you are seeking. The exception may be the NeoTech.
If you can find one, the Yamaha 356.
I have a Reynolds Medalist that would fill the bill (no, it's not for sale right now).
Unfortunately many of the small bores with F are like your 3B+F with the trigger behind the bell brace (which I prefer just because it's easier to hold). Note that most of the grip aids work in the opposite direction of what you are seeking. The exception may be the NeoTech.
- bassclef
- Posts: 337
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
Check out the Brass Exchange. They're loaded with Yamaha medium bores at the moment, including 3 640's.
I have a 640 and I use it for quite a bit of my tenor work. I love it. It's got the trigger configuration you're looking for and like most Yamahas, it's incredibly well balanced in the hand. It's great for pit work where an f-attachment is nice to have and you often need to be a tone/sound chameleon throughout the course of one service. I also use it in a 12-piece dance band where I play the second (of two) trombone parts. This part in these arrangements are in your typical 2nd trombone range with brief forays below the staff. I've been through a few .525 horns over the years and the 640 is by far my favorite one.
As mentioned above, keep your eyes out for a Benge 175f. I've had one of those and a 3Bf in the past and they're very similar. It's got a trigger setup which is in front of the brace.
It also looks like Brass Exchangehas a few of the "intermediate" medium and/or dual bore Yamahas which I've never tried, but I always read great things about them here.
I can also endorse dealing with Doug, who runs Brass Exchange. He's a trombone player and knows what he's talking about when you read his descriptions or talk with him on the phone about a particular horn. I've bought a couple from him over the years and it was always a positive experience.
I have a 640 and I use it for quite a bit of my tenor work. I love it. It's got the trigger configuration you're looking for and like most Yamahas, it's incredibly well balanced in the hand. It's great for pit work where an f-attachment is nice to have and you often need to be a tone/sound chameleon throughout the course of one service. I also use it in a 12-piece dance band where I play the second (of two) trombone parts. This part in these arrangements are in your typical 2nd trombone range with brief forays below the staff. I've been through a few .525 horns over the years and the 640 is by far my favorite one.
As mentioned above, keep your eyes out for a Benge 175f. I've had one of those and a 3Bf in the past and they're very similar. It's got a trigger setup which is in front of the brace.
It also looks like Brass Exchangehas a few of the "intermediate" medium and/or dual bore Yamahas which I've never tried, but I always read great things about them here.
I can also endorse dealing with Doug, who runs Brass Exchange. He's a trombone player and knows what he's talking about when you read his descriptions or talk with him on the phone about a particular horn. I've bought a couple from him over the years and it was always a positive experience.
- Finetales
- Posts: 1482
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
[quote="afugate"]Find a competent tech to replace the trigger setup to your liking. There are several competent techs on the trombonechat. I'd completely trust someone like Eric Edwards (boneartz) to do that work![/quote]
This! If you love your 3B+F (which it sounds like you do) and want a trombone that plays like that 3B+F, just keep the 3B+F and get a new trigger assembly made in front of the brace like the 36B. You don't need to go searching for another horn that makes you happy.
This! If you love your 3B+F (which it sounds like you do) and want a trombone that plays like that 3B+F, just keep the 3B+F and get a new trigger assembly made in front of the brace like the 36B. You don't need to go searching for another horn that makes you happy.
- Vegasbound
- Posts: 1328
- Joined: Jul 06, 2019
[quote="Finetales"]<QUOTE author="afugate" post_id="157624" time="1631757918" user_id="86">Find a competent tech to replace the trigger setup to your liking. There are several competent techs on the trombonechat. I'd completely trust someone like Eric Edwards (boneartz) to do that work![/quote]
This! If you love your 3B+F (which it sounds like you do) and want a trombone that plays like that 3B+F, just keep the 3B+F and get a new trigger assembly made in front of the brace like the 36B. You don't need to go searching for another horn that makes you happy.
</QUOTE>
This ^^^^^ :clever:
This! If you love your 3B+F (which it sounds like you do) and want a trombone that plays like that 3B+F, just keep the 3B+F and get a new trigger assembly made in front of the brace like the 36B. You don't need to go searching for another horn that makes you happy.
</QUOTE>
This ^^^^^ :clever:
- BGuttman
- Posts: 7368
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
[quote="Finetales"]<QUOTE author="afugate" post_id="157624" time="1631757918" user_id="86">Find a competent tech to replace the trigger setup to your liking. There are several competent techs on the trombonechat. I'd completely trust someone like Eric Edwards (boneartz) to do that work![/quote]
This! If you love your 3B+F (which it sounds like you do) and want a trombone that plays like that 3B+F, just keep the 3B+F and get a new trigger assembly made in front of the brace like the 36B. You don't need to go searching for another horn that makes you happy.
</QUOTE>
Dumb suggestion: Could you have a tech solder a ring to the "back" side of the King 3B+F trigger so you can move your left hand a little "forward" and still actuate the trigger?
This! If you love your 3B+F (which it sounds like you do) and want a trombone that plays like that 3B+F, just keep the 3B+F and get a new trigger assembly made in front of the brace like the 36B. You don't need to go searching for another horn that makes you happy.
</QUOTE>
Dumb suggestion: Could you have a tech solder a ring to the "back" side of the King 3B+F trigger so you can move your left hand a little "forward" and still actuate the trigger?
- John
- Posts: 21
- Joined: Jan 22, 2022
[quote="stjones"]After looking for some time for a 3b plus with f/attach, I found one. I played a straight 3B with a silver bell for 30+ years and developed a great fondness for the slide and the horn's response. Then I started trying other horns, which I don't regret. But I missed the 3B and recently managed to get a 3b plus with f/attach. It's great. Unfortunately, in the intervening years I've developed arthritis in my hands and the 3b plus trigger set up is painful. I know there are things like the Sheridan grip and the Neotech, but they don't do the trick. I have a 36b which doesn't have the trigger arrangement that the 3b does; it's an excellent horn, and it doesn't hurt my left hand. But it doesn't play like a 3B. There's a wonderful Dylan song called The Debutante, I think, in which Dylan is breaking up with a girl friend because he's found someone else. He says: "You know what I need, but she knows what I want." I need a horn like the 36b with a free standing trigger, but I want a small or medium bore horn with an f attach that plays like a 3B.
Suggestions?
BTW, if you'd be interested in a cosmetically challenged but really good playing 3B plus from the 80s with an unusually good King slide and excellent valve, stjones at umbc dot edu. I don't want to sell it, but it just isn't working for me.
Stephen[/quote]
yamaha ysl 640
Suggestions?
BTW, if you'd be interested in a cosmetically challenged but really good playing 3B plus from the 80s with an unusually good King slide and excellent valve, stjones at umbc dot edu. I don't want to sell it, but it just isn't working for me.
Stephen[/quote]
yamaha ysl 640
- spencercarran
- Posts: 689
- Joined: Oct 17, 2020
[quote="BGuttman"]See if you can find a Benge 175F. Made by King, but a little more symphonic than the King line. Same bore as the 3B+F.[/quote]
The Benge also has bad ergonomics, if we're being completely honest. Maybe not quite as bad as the 3B+F, but nowhere near as comfortable to hold as a 36b.
Best route, as others have suggested, is to find a tech who can install a better trigger assembly on the 3B+F
The Benge also has bad ergonomics, if we're being completely honest. Maybe not quite as bad as the 3B+F, but nowhere near as comfortable to hold as a 36b.
Best route, as others have suggested, is to find a tech who can install a better trigger assembly on the 3B+F
- Mikebmiller
- Posts: 961
- Joined: Mar 27, 2018
If you have a big budget, the Rath R3 is fantastic. Not just saying that because I have one.