Edwards t350 / michael rath r4f/ curtois Ac421bha
- dorutzzu92
- Posts: 49
- Joined: Jul 15, 2019
Hello guys i'm looking to buy a new trombone
I play mostly in orchestra (opera and philarmonic)
I need your opinion and your tips for this next trombones
Edwards T350 E 321CF22G/T-STDN (4.900 €)
Bb / F Tenor
Trombone8 1/2" Non-soldered
Tempered yellow-brass bell
Wall thickness: Normal (22)
T-STDN slideBore: 13.89 mm
Brass outer pull
Nickel-silver slide
Edwards Axial Flow four-way valve
Single Radius Rosebrass tuning
Edge bracing
Clear lacquered
Michael Rath R4F Tenor Hagmann ( 5.389 € )
Bb/F Tenor TromboneØ 0.547" (13.90 mm) bore
Hagmann valve
Bell size Ø 8-1/2" (215.90 mm)
Bell made of red brass
Exterior made of nickel silver
Tuning slide made of red brass
Orifice 41BClear lacquer finish
Antoine Courtois AC421BHA Bb/F ( 5.222 € )
'New York’ Model
Cylindrical bore: 13.89 mm
Hand-hammered, one-piece brass bell with 215 mm diameter
Brass outer slide
Hard chrome-plated nickel silver inner slide
With brass bow
Quart valve open wrap
Hagmann valve system with progressive bore
Ergonomic, removable hand rest
Unscrewable bellClear lacquered
Includes Marcus Bonna case
I play mostly in orchestra (opera and philarmonic)
I need your opinion and your tips for this next trombones
Edwards T350 E 321CF22G/T-STDN (4.900 €)
Bb / F Tenor
Trombone8 1/2" Non-soldered
Tempered yellow-brass bell
Wall thickness: Normal (22)
T-STDN slideBore: 13.89 mm
Brass outer pull
Nickel-silver slide
Edwards Axial Flow four-way valve
Single Radius Rosebrass tuning
Edge bracing
Clear lacquered
Michael Rath R4F Tenor Hagmann ( 5.389 € )
Bb/F Tenor TromboneØ 0.547" (13.90 mm) bore
Hagmann valve
Bell size Ø 8-1/2" (215.90 mm)
Bell made of red brass
Exterior made of nickel silver
Tuning slide made of red brass
Orifice 41BClear lacquer finish
Antoine Courtois AC421BHA Bb/F ( 5.222 € )
'New York’ Model
Cylindrical bore: 13.89 mm
Hand-hammered, one-piece brass bell with 215 mm diameter
Brass outer slide
Hard chrome-plated nickel silver inner slide
With brass bow
Quart valve open wrap
Hagmann valve system with progressive bore
Ergonomic, removable hand rest
Unscrewable bellClear lacquered
Includes Marcus Bonna case
- BGuttman
- Posts: 7368
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
These are all well-regarded symphony trombones.
Question 1: What are you planning to play? (type of music: Orchestra? Brass Band? Concert Band? Jazz? Everything?)
Question 2: What type of tone do you usually get? Do you need to "correct" something about it?
If at all possible, I would recommend you test play all 3 and see if one plays better than the others.
I should point out that the Edwards is highly customizable and you are usually "fitted" with a bunch of parts. If you can get a fitting session, go in with an open mind. The combination you like best may be a lot different from what you just described.
Question 1: What are you planning to play? (type of music: Orchestra? Brass Band? Concert Band? Jazz? Everything?)
Question 2: What type of tone do you usually get? Do you need to "correct" something about it?
If at all possible, I would recommend you test play all 3 and see if one plays better than the others.
I should point out that the Edwards is highly customizable and you are usually "fitted" with a bunch of parts. If you can get a fitting session, go in with an open mind. The combination you like best may be a lot different from what you just described.
- tbonesullivan
- Posts: 1959
- Joined: Jul 02, 2019
What trombone are you playing right now, and what do you want to change about your sound? Deciding on a horn "by the specs" often is not the best way. There are many stories of players going in to get fitted for a modular horn, and walking out with a horn quite a bit different than what they thought they would need.
- Chatname
- Posts: 233
- Joined: Oct 19, 2019
I play the same repertoire as you, it seems. Mostly opera. I use a M&W 2Y. It’s great.
- BGuttman
- Posts: 7368
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
OK. Still don't know why you would want to change if everything is great. I notice a lot of red brass in your choices. Is the M&W too bright?
- hornbuilder
- Posts: 1384
- Joined: May 02, 2018
[quote="BGuttman"]OK. Still don't know why you would want to change if everything is great. I notice a lot of red brass in your choices. Is the M&W too bright?[/quote]
Bruce. The OP had not mentioned M&W in any way. He also told us the type of music he plays in the original post. The mention came from someone else who "does" play M&W, and is very happy with it. FWIW, 2Y means a 2 piece yellow bell.
Bruce. The OP had not mentioned M&W in any way. He also told us the type of music he plays in the original post. The mention came from someone else who "does" play M&W, and is very happy with it. FWIW, 2Y means a 2 piece yellow bell.
- dorutzzu92
- Posts: 49
- Joined: Jul 15, 2019
I don't have in my country/ city the opurtunity to play test this instruments, i have to order them obline, so the specs and the hope that it will ne a good horn si the only thing i can do....
- whitbey
- Posts: 654
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
I will say that Edwards has been great for me. The main reason is the understanding they have to fit you to a horn. I feel there horns are as good as any. But the ability to custom fit you so that you play well really is the big deal.
The best way to choose the parts at Edwards is to to sit and play, let them change the horn. Tell them what you think of the horn and listen to what they say they hear. And do not try to figure out the parts until you found the horn you like.
Getting changes to a horn you have or putting something together over the phone. Tell them what you got for sound and response, then try what they recommend.
It is much more fun to talk and brag about the components after the good horn is on your hand.
The best way to choose the parts at Edwards is to to sit and play, let them change the horn. Tell them what you think of the horn and listen to what they say they hear. And do not try to figure out the parts until you found the horn you like.
Getting changes to a horn you have or putting something together over the phone. Tell them what you got for sound and response, then try what they recommend.
It is much more fun to talk and brag about the components after the good horn is on your hand.
- BGuttman
- Posts: 7368
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
[quote="whitbey"]I will say that Edwards has been great for me. The main reason is the understanding they have to fit you to a horn. I feel there horns are as good as any. But the ability to custom fit you so that you play well really is the big deal.
The best way to choose the parts at Edwards is to to sit and play, let them change the horn. Tell them what you think of the horn and listen to what they say they hear. And do not try to figure out the parts until you found the horn you like.
Getting changes to a horn you have or putting something together over the phone. Tell them what you got for sound and response, then try what they recommend.
It is much more fun to talk and brag about the components after the good horn is on your hand.[/quote]
Quite true, but OP is located where there are no Edwards dealers (Eastern Europe) and can't try parts. Makes things much more difficult.
The best way to choose the parts at Edwards is to to sit and play, let them change the horn. Tell them what you think of the horn and listen to what they say they hear. And do not try to figure out the parts until you found the horn you like.
Getting changes to a horn you have or putting something together over the phone. Tell them what you got for sound and response, then try what they recommend.
It is much more fun to talk and brag about the components after the good horn is on your hand.[/quote]
Quite true, but OP is located where there are no Edwards dealers (Eastern Europe) and can't try parts. Makes things much more difficult.
- tombone21
- Posts: 208
- Joined: Nov 14, 2018
I'd go for the Courtois. They are very flexible instruments, easy to play, and made very well. The Edwards and Rath are also fine instruments, but sit on pretty opposite sides of the sound and feel spectrums (Bach and Conn) so unless you have a very specific idea of what you want, I'd give the Courtois in the middle a go. They are fabulous instruments that were designed in consultation with the Met Opera section.