Olds Opera TIS?
- Mamaposaune
- Posts: 657
- Joined: Sep 22, 2018
Someone has an Olds Opera TIS advertised on one of the Facebook groups. Has anyone ever seen one? To further confuse things, it says it was made in Fullerton, but has a french-style case like Olds used in the 40's-50's.
- JohnL
- Posts: 2529
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
Never seen any indication of a TIS Opera in any catalogs. Can you post a link to the listing?
It might be something put together out of parts from an Opera and a TIS bass.
It might be something put together out of parts from an Opera and a TIS bass.
- Elow
- Posts: 1924
- Joined: Mar 02, 2020
- BGuttman
- Posts: 7368
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
It sure loos like my LM-8 Olds (except mine is silver plated with a chrome bell). Slide looks like it has a small shank receiver.
Wish they had photographed the engraving. My LM-8 is from Los Angeles.
Wish they had photographed the engraving. My LM-8 is from Los Angeles.
- Doug_Elliott
- Posts: 4155
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
Slide lock, and bell lock nut? Seems to me those features don't agree with that bell section. I would suspect it's been modified. Nice job though...
It's not the usual Opera, it has to be a much earlier model.
It's not the usual Opera, it has to be a much earlier model.
- JohnL
- Posts: 2529
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
Not enough in the pictures to draw any definitive conclusions. I, too, would really like to see the bell engraving - and a partial serial number. Be nice to know if it's large shank or small shank.
The Operas don't appear in the catalogs until 1958, which was a few years after Olds' move to Fullerton, and they're shown as being of conventional bell-tuning configuration. That said, I've seen too much oddball stuff to dismiss something like this. It could be that someone went to Olds and asked them to build something with an Opera Fanfare (O-115) bell mated up to a TIS J-bend and slide. Olds did make symphony-bore TIS tenors at one time, and they might have had some parts still on hand at the Fullerton factory. Lots of maybes, but none that are beyond reason.
Personally, I think it's more likely that it's an aftermarket custom job (assuming that's actually an Opera bell).
As for the case? Olds used that style for many years, at least up into the early 1960's for some models, so even that isn't much help.
Interesting that they say it has a red brass bell. Looks pretty yellow to me.
The Operas don't appear in the catalogs until 1958, which was a few years after Olds' move to Fullerton, and they're shown as being of conventional bell-tuning configuration. That said, I've seen too much oddball stuff to dismiss something like this. It could be that someone went to Olds and asked them to build something with an Opera Fanfare (O-115) bell mated up to a TIS J-bend and slide. Olds did make symphony-bore TIS tenors at one time, and they might have had some parts still on hand at the Fullerton factory. Lots of maybes, but none that are beyond reason.
Personally, I think it's more likely that it's an aftermarket custom job (assuming that's actually an Opera bell).
As for the case? Olds used that style for many years, at least up into the early 1960's for some models, so even that isn't much help.
Interesting that they say it has a red brass bell. Looks pretty yellow to me.
- calcbone
- Posts: 225
- Joined: Jun 11, 2018
Speaking of the bell lock nut…I’ve had a few Olds (50’s Amabssador, 70’s Super Star, and now a 60’s Super) and all of them have had the nut on the slide section, like a King. This one has it on the bell, in the manner of Bach, Conn, etc… was this ever a thing at Olds?
- JohnL
- Posts: 2529
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
[quote="calcbone"]Speaking of the bell lock nut…I’ve had a few Olds (50’s Amabssador, 70’s Super Star, and now a 60’s Super) and all of them have had the nut on the slide section, like a King. This one has it on the bell, in the manner of Bach, Conn, etc… was this ever a thing at Olds?[/quote]
Operas and basses typically have their tenon nuts on the bell section.
It's an odd duck. If it weren't for the tenon nut and slide lock, it'd look an awful lot like a typical symphony-bore Standard TIS. The cork barrels do look like Olds parts, but the slide lock is the style used on the smaller horns (Recording, Super, etc.); the big stuff has a "claw-style" slide lock.
[quote="JohnL"]Interesting that they say it has a red brass bell. Looks pretty yellow to me.[/quote]
On further examination, there does appear to be a color difference between the bell tail and the bell flare. You see that on several Olds models (Studios and Specials); I've got one pre-WWII example in my collection:
http://itsabear.com/horns/SB-tt/SB-tt.html
It pretty much shouts "PARTS HORN!", but is it something Olds put together at the factory or is it the something a tech put together? There's techs who do work that you'd swear was factory original.
Operas and basses typically have their tenon nuts on the bell section.
It's an odd duck. If it weren't for the tenon nut and slide lock, it'd look an awful lot like a typical symphony-bore Standard TIS. The cork barrels do look like Olds parts, but the slide lock is the style used on the smaller horns (Recording, Super, etc.); the big stuff has a "claw-style" slide lock.
[quote="JohnL"]Interesting that they say it has a red brass bell. Looks pretty yellow to me.[/quote]
On further examination, there does appear to be a color difference between the bell tail and the bell flare. You see that on several Olds models (Studios and Specials); I've got one pre-WWII example in my collection:
http://itsabear.com/horns/SB-tt/SB-tt.html
It pretty much shouts "PARTS HORN!", but is it something Olds put together at the factory or is it the something a tech put together? There's techs who do work that you'd swear was factory original.