Cleaning a nasty instrument case
- MelAE
- Posts: 3
- Joined: Apr 30, 2022
Recently bought a new(old) trombone that had clearly been sitting in someone's attic for god knows how long, really cool instrument, has an trigger built into the tuning slide so you can switch it out and make it a straight trombone. The whole thing came with a custom case which is custom tailored to the weird dimensions of the instrument and is also absolutely filthy, every time I put the horn away it comes out smelling awful and I don't know how to clean it.
My first instinct is just to cover inside of the case in dish soap and take a garden hose to it, but I'm sort of afraid it might just disintegrate.
Any suggestions/sage advice would be appreciated.
My first instinct is just to cover inside of the case in dish soap and take a garden hose to it, but I'm sort of afraid it might just disintegrate.
Any suggestions/sage advice would be appreciated.
- BGuttman
- Posts: 7368
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
Hello and Welcome!
That awful smell can come from the case itself. Often a mildew builds up inside the case. The mildew is under the fabric lining and is VERY difficult to kill. I've heard that people will put the empty case inside a car with an ozone generator going inside the car. Sometimes you can get an improvement from leaving the case open outside in bright sunlight for a couple of days (note: if it gets rained on you are back to square 1). Some people will just put a dryer sheet in the case and replace it from time to time. Best solution is to trash the case and get a new one.
The horn itself can improve with a good cleaning. A soak in warm (not hot) water with some dish soap can eliminate any bacteria that cause a smell. Of course if the case is the problem (see above) this is a VERY temporary solution.
Good luck.
That awful smell can come from the case itself. Often a mildew builds up inside the case. The mildew is under the fabric lining and is VERY difficult to kill. I've heard that people will put the empty case inside a car with an ozone generator going inside the car. Sometimes you can get an improvement from leaving the case open outside in bright sunlight for a couple of days (note: if it gets rained on you are back to square 1). Some people will just put a dryer sheet in the case and replace it from time to time. Best solution is to trash the case and get a new one.
The horn itself can improve with a good cleaning. A soak in warm (not hot) water with some dish soap can eliminate any bacteria that cause a smell. Of course if the case is the problem (see above) this is a VERY temporary solution.
Good luck.
- ithinknot
- Posts: 1339
- Joined: Jul 24, 2020
Chuck it and move on. We've all been there and, as Bruce says, once the mildew is in the plywood it's cursed.
A new case doesn't cost nothing, but imagine paying for your futile cleaning time (plus chemicals and shamanic consultation fees) only to end up binning the old case anyway.
Boosey and Hawkes with the tuning slide trigger?
A new case doesn't cost nothing, but imagine paying for your futile cleaning time (plus chemicals and shamanic consultation fees) only to end up binning the old case anyway.
Boosey and Hawkes with the tuning slide trigger?
- MelAE
- Posts: 3
- Joined: Apr 30, 2022
[quote="BGuttman"]Hello and Welcome!
That awful smell can come from the case itself. Often a mildew builds up inside the case. The mildew is under the fabric lining and is VERY difficult to kill. I've heard that people will put the empty case inside a car with an ozone generator going inside the car. Sometimes you can get an improvement from leaving the case open outside in bright sunlight for a couple of days (note: if it gets rained on you are back to square 1). Some people will just put a dryer sheet in the case and replace it from time to time. Best solution is to trash the case and get a new one.
The horn itself can improve with a good cleaning. A soak in warm (not hot) water with some dish soap can eliminate any bacteria that cause a smell. Of course if the case is the problem (see above) this is a VERY temporary solution.
Good luck.[/quote]
I already cleaned the horn itself when I first got my hands on it, so I'm nearly positive that the smell is coming from the case, sucks to hear that there's pretty much nothing to be done about it.
[quote="ithinknot"]Chuck it and move on. We've all been there and, as Bruce says, once the mildew is in the plywood it's cursed.
A new case doesn't cost nothing, but imagine paying for your futile cleaning time (plus chemicals and shamanic consultation fees) only to end up binning the old case anyway.[/quote]
You make a fair point, will probably just buy a cheap gig bag or keep it on a stand until I find an excuse to play it outside of my house
As for this, I'm not really sure what it is
The only identifying marks on it are these on the bell section, I think it says Karl Münnich, Eilbach/Virgil, no serial number or anything
When I look up "Karl Münnich" I get an obituary for a radiologist, so not really sure what's up with that
The whole thing is proportioned very weirdly, the bell flare seems enormous compared to the bore, and the slide is about ~3 inches longer than my Getzen's
That awful smell can come from the case itself. Often a mildew builds up inside the case. The mildew is under the fabric lining and is VERY difficult to kill. I've heard that people will put the empty case inside a car with an ozone generator going inside the car. Sometimes you can get an improvement from leaving the case open outside in bright sunlight for a couple of days (note: if it gets rained on you are back to square 1). Some people will just put a dryer sheet in the case and replace it from time to time. Best solution is to trash the case and get a new one.
The horn itself can improve with a good cleaning. A soak in warm (not hot) water with some dish soap can eliminate any bacteria that cause a smell. Of course if the case is the problem (see above) this is a VERY temporary solution.
Good luck.[/quote]
I already cleaned the horn itself when I first got my hands on it, so I'm nearly positive that the smell is coming from the case, sucks to hear that there's pretty much nothing to be done about it.
[quote="ithinknot"]Chuck it and move on. We've all been there and, as Bruce says, once the mildew is in the plywood it's cursed.
A new case doesn't cost nothing, but imagine paying for your futile cleaning time (plus chemicals and shamanic consultation fees) only to end up binning the old case anyway.[/quote]
You make a fair point, will probably just buy a cheap gig bag or keep it on a stand until I find an excuse to play it outside of my house
Boosey and Hawkes with the tuning slide trigger?
As for this, I'm not really sure what it is
The only identifying marks on it are these on the bell section, I think it says Karl Münnich, Eilbach/Virgil, no serial number or anything
When I look up "Karl Münnich" I get an obituary for a radiologist, so not really sure what's up with that
The whole thing is proportioned very weirdly, the bell flare seems enormous compared to the bore, and the slide is about ~3 inches longer than my Getzen's
- BGuttman
- Posts: 7368
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
It's Monnich, with the umlaut on the o. This is a typical German style trombone of the inter-war period. Large bell, long slide (probably dual bore), valve actuated by a thong. I like the King style bell brace. I'm surprised it doesn't have a mechanism to actuate the water key from where you hold the slide.
Big question: how does it play? Probably nothing like a Getzen, I'll bet.
Big question: how does it play? Probably nothing like a Getzen, I'll bet.
- tbonesullivan
- Posts: 1959
- Joined: Jul 02, 2019
[quote="MelAE"]When I look up "Karl Münnich" I get an obituary for a radiologist, so not really sure what's up with that[/quote] It is Karl Mönnich of Erlbach / Vogtl., which is short for Vogtland, or possibly Vogtlandkreis. Today, Erlbach is part of Markneukirchen, and around that area was basically the heard of German / Czech brass instrument making. From what I can find, this is probably post WWII, as he was still making trombones in the early 1990s.
<LINK_TEXT text="https://www.horn-u-copia.net/show.php?s ... Monnich%22">https://www.horn-u-copia.net/show.php?selby=+where+instrument%3D%22Trombone%22+and+maker%3D%22Monnich%22</LINK_TEXT>
<LINK_TEXT text="https://www.horn-u-copia.net/show.php?s ... Monnich%22">https://www.horn-u-copia.net/show.php?selby=+where+instrument%3D%22Trombone%22+and+maker%3D%22Monnich%22</LINK_TEXT>
- MelAE
- Posts: 3
- Joined: Apr 30, 2022
[quote="tbonesullivan"]It is Karl Mönnich of Erlbach / Vogtl., which is short for Vogtland, or possibly Vogtlandkreis.[/quote]
Oh no! My inability to read cursive is showing haha
At least that explains why I wasn't having any luck googling the name
[quote="BGuttman"]Big question: how does it play? Probably nothing like a Getzen, I'll bet.[/quote]
You're absolutely right, it plays nothing like any other horn I've ever tried, best way I can think to phrase it is very direct, not in the sense that the sound is super focused but that it's not very resonant/lacks overtones if that makes any sense. The metal on the bell section is super super thin so I think that might have something to do with it. I would like to play it as a straight trombone primarily but the crossbar is too high up to comfortably rest my thumb on so I've gotta leave the trigger slide on so I don't strain my hand while I'm playing it
Oh no! My inability to read cursive is showing haha
At least that explains why I wasn't having any luck googling the name
[quote="BGuttman"]Big question: how does it play? Probably nothing like a Getzen, I'll bet.[/quote]
You're absolutely right, it plays nothing like any other horn I've ever tried, best way I can think to phrase it is very direct, not in the sense that the sound is super focused but that it's not very resonant/lacks overtones if that makes any sense. The metal on the bell section is super super thin so I think that might have something to do with it. I would like to play it as a straight trombone primarily but the crossbar is too high up to comfortably rest my thumb on so I've gotta leave the trigger slide on so I don't strain my hand while I'm playing it
- ithinknot
- Posts: 1339
- Joined: Jul 24, 2020
[quote="MelAE"]I would like to play it as a straight trombone primarily but the crossbar is too high up to comfortably rest my thumb[/quote]
Ah, don't even try. On earlier German instruments the bell brace is even further back.
LH grip uses only the inner slide. Look at the Paul Weschke portrait (or anyone holding a sackbut).
Ah, don't even try. On earlier German instruments the bell brace is even further back.
LH grip uses only the inner slide. Look at the Paul Weschke portrait (or anyone holding a sackbut).
- baileyman
- Posts: 1169
- Joined: Mar 24, 2018
At least put the case outside for a few days in the sunshine before doing something drastic.
- whitbey
- Posts: 654
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
Put a bowl of vinegar in the case and leave it closed for a while. I use the vinegar to rinse out my horn, a tray in my truck cleans out that coney island and I used it to clean the smoke smell out of a house with lots of trays. I am a realtor and need to do that too often.
- baroquetrombone
- Posts: 48
- Joined: Apr 16, 2018
Try everything before pitching it. Cases for German trombones are not east to come by in the US and ordering them is a pain.
In the meantime, don't put the trombone back in it. Being in TX, I'd think a good start will be leaving it open outside for a few hot/sunny days- the more, the better, just don't leave it overnight so it gets wet.
Worst case, you (or someone else) can completely strip it and rebuild it, which is what I did when I couldn't find anything that would fit mine.
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In the meantime, don't put the trombone back in it. Being in TX, I'd think a good start will be leaving it open outside for a few hot/sunny days- the more, the better, just don't leave it overnight so it gets wet.
Worst case, you (or someone else) can completely strip it and rebuild it, which is what I did when I couldn't find anything that would fit mine.
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- Posaunus
- Posts: 5018
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
[quote="baroquetrombone"]Worst case, you (or someone else) can completely strip it and rebuild it, which is what I did when I couldn't find anything that would fit mine.[/quote]
Very nice restoration! :good:
Very nice restoration! :good:
- whitbey
- Posts: 654
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
Real good looking work.
Where did you get what kind of materials?
What kind of glue did you use?
Where did you get what kind of materials?
What kind of glue did you use?
- baroquetrombone
- Posts: 48
- Joined: Apr 16, 2018
[quote="whitbey"]Real good looking work.
Where did you get what kind of materials?
What kind of glue did you use?[/quote]
I hate to sidetrack the op's post. I should really make a thread about this...
I have a roll of black Tolex that I ordered from somewhere (Wal-Mart, I think) to do another case, so I used that for the outside. In the past, I'd used 3M spray adhesive for it, but on this one I tried contact cement. It holds better on the curves, but they're both a pain. The outside is not perfect by any measure, but it's a LOT better than it was.
I've gotten pretty good at insides now. This one has felt from JoAnn Fabric. I did a couple 19th century French trombone cases with a crushed velvet type material, which was original in one of those, but the Germans seem to use felt. This case originally had a faded, thin blue, so I got as close as I could. It's much easier to work with than the velvet. Anything padded has some sort of polyester furniture padding under the felt. Everything on the inside is done with 3M spray adhesive.
Most of the interior bits have to be made or re-made. New stuff is made of whatever wood I have sitting around.
It's a lot of work, but it's pretty cool to have a new-looking old case and for this one, I could find no other option. I just wish I was better at doing the outsides, but it's not like I use any of these things daily except for a week here and there.
Where did you get what kind of materials?
What kind of glue did you use?[/quote]
I hate to sidetrack the op's post. I should really make a thread about this...
I have a roll of black Tolex that I ordered from somewhere (Wal-Mart, I think) to do another case, so I used that for the outside. In the past, I'd used 3M spray adhesive for it, but on this one I tried contact cement. It holds better on the curves, but they're both a pain. The outside is not perfect by any measure, but it's a LOT better than it was.
I've gotten pretty good at insides now. This one has felt from JoAnn Fabric. I did a couple 19th century French trombone cases with a crushed velvet type material, which was original in one of those, but the Germans seem to use felt. This case originally had a faded, thin blue, so I got as close as I could. It's much easier to work with than the velvet. Anything padded has some sort of polyester furniture padding under the felt. Everything on the inside is done with 3M spray adhesive.
Most of the interior bits have to be made or re-made. New stuff is made of whatever wood I have sitting around.
It's a lot of work, but it's pretty cool to have a new-looking old case and for this one, I could find no other option. I just wish I was better at doing the outsides, but it's not like I use any of these things daily except for a week here and there.
- whitbey
- Posts: 654
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
[quote="baroquetrombone"]<QUOTE author="whitbey" post_id="178111" time="1652018186" user_id="125">
Real good looking work.
Where did you get what kind of materials?
What kind of glue did you use?[/quote]
I hate to sidetrack the op's post. I should really make a thread about this...
I have a roll of black Tolex that I ordered from somewhere (Wal-Mart, I think) to do another case, so I used that for the outside. In the past, I'd used 3M spray adhesive for it, but on this one I tried contact cement. It holds better on the curves, but they're both a pain. The outside is not perfect by any measure, but it's a LOT better than it was.
I've gotten pretty good at insides now. This one has felt from JoAnn Fabric. I did a couple 19th century French trombone cases with a crushed velvet type material, which was original in one of those, but the Germans seem to use felt. This case originally had a faded, thin blue, so I got as close as I could. It's much easier to work with than the velvet. Anything padded has some sort of polyester furniture padding under the felt. Everything on the inside is done with 3M spray adhesive.
Most of the interior bits have to be made or re-made. New stuff is made of whatever wood I have sitting around.
It's a lot of work, but it's pretty cool to have a new-looking old case and for this one, I could find no other option. I just wish I was better at doing the outsides, but it's not like I use any of these things daily except for a week here and there.
</QUOTE>
Thanks. I have an old Edward bone that got hit with water that will need a redo. I searched Tolex and found they have glue too.
Did you find anything for the corners/edges of the case?
Real good looking work.
Where did you get what kind of materials?
What kind of glue did you use?[/quote]
I hate to sidetrack the op's post. I should really make a thread about this...
I have a roll of black Tolex that I ordered from somewhere (Wal-Mart, I think) to do another case, so I used that for the outside. In the past, I'd used 3M spray adhesive for it, but on this one I tried contact cement. It holds better on the curves, but they're both a pain. The outside is not perfect by any measure, but it's a LOT better than it was.
I've gotten pretty good at insides now. This one has felt from JoAnn Fabric. I did a couple 19th century French trombone cases with a crushed velvet type material, which was original in one of those, but the Germans seem to use felt. This case originally had a faded, thin blue, so I got as close as I could. It's much easier to work with than the velvet. Anything padded has some sort of polyester furniture padding under the felt. Everything on the inside is done with 3M spray adhesive.
Most of the interior bits have to be made or re-made. New stuff is made of whatever wood I have sitting around.
It's a lot of work, but it's pretty cool to have a new-looking old case and for this one, I could find no other option. I just wish I was better at doing the outsides, but it's not like I use any of these things daily except for a week here and there.
</QUOTE>
Thanks. I have an old Edward bone that got hit with water that will need a redo. I searched Tolex and found they have glue too.
Did you find anything for the corners/edges of the case?
- baroquetrombone
- Posts: 48
- Joined: Apr 16, 2018
[quote="whitbey"]Thanks. I have an old Edward bone that got hit with water that will need a redo. I searched Tolex and found they have glue too.
Did you find anything for the corners/edges of the case?[/quote]
My cases weren't built with them, but I did look for them once just out of curiosity and a bunch of different options exist. I think searching for guitar amp corners will start you down the appropriate rabbit hole.
Unless you mean the brown leather on the edges of the tan Edwards cases. I don't know how to do that....
Did you find anything for the corners/edges of the case?[/quote]
My cases weren't built with them, but I did look for them once just out of curiosity and a bunch of different options exist. I think searching for guitar amp corners will start you down the appropriate rabbit hole.
Unless you mean the brown leather on the edges of the tan Edwards cases. I don't know how to do that....
- Mamaposaune
- Posts: 657
- Joined: Sep 22, 2018
I have completely re-done stinky cases, it is very time consuming but can be rewarding and cool to have something unique.
I recently posted under Accessories, the thread is titled "my new-old Bach case" and briefly described steps and materials used.
I recently posted under Accessories, the thread is titled "my new-old Bach case" and briefly described steps and materials used.