Unusual Yamaha Mouthpiece

dcslideman · by **dcslideman** » 2022-05-21 12:30 p.m.

I was interested to compare gold plating with silver plating as I had never sprung for gold plating before. I saw a used gold-plated Yamaha 48 at a good price so I got it. When I got it I am quite puzzled by some things. I have a silver Yamaha 48 that came with a Yamaha trombone I bought new. This first picture shows that the gold plated one is longer. The tip outer diameter is virtually the same but the inner diameter at the tip is .030 " bigger. There are very faint lines suggesting insertion to a normal depth on some other instrument. The region below the cup is different than 99% of Yamaha mouthpieces. It does not have the expanded ring seen on the silver one, but is actually a bit recessed. This looks somewhat like what they did on the special Yeo Large bore mouthpiece. I saw one other picture on a Google search of a Yamaha 66 with this shape in the neck. I couldn't tell length from the picture. The engraving matches on the two different mouthpieces.

It sounds reasonably good on a quick play; a little warmer than the normal 48. It lowers pitch about 10 cents.

Any idea what I got? I don't know much about medium bores, but from my reading, that doesn't seem to be it. Is it a genuine Yamaha?

tbonesullivan · by **tbonesullivan** » 2022-05-21 12:59 p.m.

That's definitely interesting. Maybe it's a European / Medium shank mouthpiece? That's definitely not a small shank.

dcslideman · by **dcslideman** » 2022-05-21 2:15 p.m.

Rescanning the auction description, the original source of this is said to be a Yamaha America Public Relations staff member who retired and liquidated a stash of demo units. So, it would seem to be actual Yamaha and not a knock-off.

greenbean · by **greenbean** » 2022-05-21 2:50 p.m.

The early Yamaha mouthpieces had that shape in the bore area. So, glancing at it, it looks like an ordinary (early) mouthpiece. But I don't remember them having odd-sized shanks.

Fujiifilm17 · by **Fujiifilm17** » 2022-05-21 2:51 p.m.

The different outer shape is characteristic of older Yamaha mouthpieces from what I've gathered. I have a large shank Yamaha 47 that came with a YSL-643 I bought a few years ago that has the same design, although the model number isn't next to the "Yamaha Japan" stamp. Instead it's on the otherside of the cup, kind of like some vintage Bach pieces.

I've attached a photo to show a comparison with an old (large shank) Schilke 50 with the longer shank.

dcslideman · by **dcslideman** » 2022-05-21 4:04 p.m.

[quote="Fujiifilm17"]The different outer shape is characteristic of older Yamaha mouthpieces from what I've gathered.[/quote]

Thanks for the picture and info! That neck area does look the same. Here is a new picture to which I added a large shank 48 as well. Left to right we have: 48 small shank, 48 weird one, 48 large shank. I put a bunch of dimensions on it. My cheap phone camera has kind of distorted the picture so the outer ones look like they are leaning. I didn't put it in the dimensions, but the unknown one is exactly the same overall length as the large shank even though the picture distorts that. It looks like some frankstein of a small shank and large shank. Is it some type of medium bore?

Burgerbob · by **Burgerbob** » 2022-05-21 4:17 p.m.

Yup, that's the old blank.

dcslideman · by **dcslideman** » 2022-05-23 7:18 p.m.

[quote="Burgerbob"]Yup, that's the old blank.[/quote]

Were the mouthpieces of this old style always extra long?

OneTon · by **OneTon** » 2022-05-23 8:14 p.m.

Renold Schilke provided consulting to Yamaha during a period of their early years when Yamaha re-entered the brass music instrument business. That Yamaha gold mouthpiece is similar to what he was producing at the time. His justification was that reducing the step off from the mouthpiece to the leadpipe.

TromboneTallie · by **TromboneTallie** » 2022-05-23 8:23 p.m.

That doesn't make a lot of sense though, unless the leadpipes were way different. You would need to reduce the tip diameter for it to go in farther and reduce the gap, whole keeping the overall length -- you can see how far out that thing sticks in the first post.

Burgerbob · by **Burgerbob** » 2022-05-23 8:38 p.m.

[quote="dcslideman"]<QUOTE author="Burgerbob" post_id="178952" time="1653164269" user_id="3131">
Yup, that's the old blank.[/quote]

Were the mouthpieces of this old style always extra long?
</QUOTE>

I think mine were longer than the more modern ones, not as long as yours though.

elmsandr · by **elmsandr** » 2022-05-24 7:44 a.m.

[quote="TromboneTallie"]That doesn't make a lot of sense though, unless the leadpipes were way different. You would need to reduce the tip diameter for it to go in farther and reduce the gap, whole keeping the overall length -- you can see how far out that thing sticks in the first post.[/quote]
Take a look in the backbores of the longer Schilkes... there were different taper rates in a few areas, so that was what he was going for.

And no, they do not seat deeper in, still a standard 1" (usually).

Cheers,

Andy

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Unusual Yamaha Mouthpiece