Live and learn ...
- musicofnote
- Posts: 367
- Joined: Jun 03, 2022
content deleted by author
- hyperbolica
- Posts: 3990
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
Totally agree. Objective reality in a subjective pursuit is so often disappointing. I've made similar recordings comparing horns, and never proved what I expected to prove.
- BGuttman
- Posts: 7368
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
On a similar vein, just changing mouthpieces is not going to instantly solve problems. If you sound like a wounded moose on your current mouthpiece, switching to [insert Trombone God here] mouthpiece won't make you play any better. Practicing your butt off will make you play better. Of course if the mouthpiece doesn't "fit", you can't put in the time.
- robcat2075
- Posts: 1867
- Joined: Sep 03, 2018
I am unsurprised by this result.
I can foresee a dozen objections true believers would advance but after we eliminated each one the end result would probably still be the same and your conclusion the correct one.
For a set of mouthpieces you are comfortable playing, the moment-to-moment variation in human performance is probably greater than whatever variation the mouthpiece introduces.
I also suspect the nature of sound waves in air is to lose detail with distance. Maybe the differences you hear as a player really are there but get averaged out beyond a few feet from the horn.
I can foresee a dozen objections true believers would advance but after we eliminated each one the end result would probably still be the same and your conclusion the correct one.
For a set of mouthpieces you are comfortable playing, the moment-to-moment variation in human performance is probably greater than whatever variation the mouthpiece introduces.
I also suspect the nature of sound waves in air is to lose detail with distance. Maybe the differences you hear as a player really are there but get averaged out beyond a few feet from the horn.
- CharlieB
- Posts: 434
- Joined: Mar 29, 2018
The first time I heard a recording of my voice played back to me, my reaction was, "That's not the way I really sound." I had the same reaction when my first trombone recordings were played back to me. In both instances, others listening to the playbacks assured me that the recordings were accurate reproductions of my sound.
For some reason, my brain seems to perceive the sounds it detects from my vocal chords or from a horn pressed against my face differently from the recorded sounds that align with what others hear. No clue why.
For some reason, my brain seems to perceive the sounds it detects from my vocal chords or from a horn pressed against my face differently from the recorded sounds that align with what others hear. No clue why.
- GabrielRice
- Posts: 1496
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
[quote="CharlieB"]The first time I heard a recording of my voice played back to me, my reaction was, "That's not the way I really sound." I had the same reaction when my first trombone recordings were played back to me. In both instances, others listening to the playbacks assured me that the recordings were accurate reproductions of my sound.
For some reason, my brain seems to perceive the sounds it detects from my vocal chords or from a horn pressed against my face differently from the recorded sounds that align with what others hear. No clue why.[/quote]
Part of the way we hear ourselves is bone conduction inside our own heads.
For some reason, my brain seems to perceive the sounds it detects from my vocal chords or from a horn pressed against my face differently from the recorded sounds that align with what others hear. No clue why.[/quote]
Part of the way we hear ourselves is bone conduction inside our own heads.
- Matt_K
- Posts: 4809
- Joined: Mar 21, 2018
I think a lot of things that we think change our sound do... but indirectly. If something is "easy" for you to play, you'll likely play more musically. I'm of the opinion that a lot of the "direct" things that are changed are perceptual because of the vibrations that our body picks up on. So things like weights on valve covers, oversleeves, mouthpiece weight, possibly material of the instrument... it touches our body and we get some degree of sympathetic vibrations. That's the bone conduction thing that Gabriel was talking about. That would also explain why the farther away from the mouthpiece, the less effect something seems to have on me.
- CharlieB
- Posts: 434
- Joined: Mar 29, 2018
[quote="GabrielRice"]
Part of the way we hear ourselves is bone conduction inside our own heads.[/quote]
AHA !
Thanks Gabe.
So, playing trombone vibrates one's skull.
That could explain a whole lotta stuff. ) ) )
Part of the way we hear ourselves is bone conduction inside our own heads.[/quote]
AHA !
Thanks Gabe.
So, playing trombone vibrates one's skull.
That could explain a whole lotta stuff. ) ) )
- Doug_Elliott
- Posts: 4155
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
Also there's some cancellation at the eardrum between the sound inside your mouth and what comes back in through your ears.
- paulyg
- Posts: 689
- Joined: May 17, 2018
Yup, phase lagged signals acting like a really crappy feedback cancelling mic.
- robcat2075
- Posts: 1867
- Joined: Sep 03, 2018
Variation to try... sing "mmmmmmm..." then use the palm of your hand to seal off your outer ear.
The "mmmmmm" will sound louder.
The "mmmmmm" will sound louder.
- soseggnchips
- Posts: 92
- Joined: Jan 29, 2021
I find that a problem with earplugs: they do a good job reducing the volume of the other instruments, but as soon as I start playing all I can hear is me! I try to avoid using them wherever possible.
On the original point about mouthpieces... I do think a lot of the perceived difference between gear is to do with feedback and comfort rather than an actual change in the sound out front. That's not to say don't be discriminating about your gear; being comfortable and having the right feedback are really important... but don't be surprised if no-one else notices.
On the original point about mouthpieces... I do think a lot of the perceived difference between gear is to do with feedback and comfort rather than an actual change in the sound out front. That's not to say don't be discriminating about your gear; being comfortable and having the right feedback are really important... but don't be surprised if no-one else notices.
- imsevimse
- Posts: 1765
- Joined: Apr 29, 2018
[quote="CharlieB"]The first time I heard a recording of my voice played back to me, my reaction was, "That's not the way I really sound." I had the same reaction when my first trombone recordings were played back to me. In both instances, others listening to the playbacks assured me that the recordings were accurate reproductions of my sound.
For some reason, my brain seems to perceive the sounds it detects from my vocal chords or from a horn pressed against my face differently from the recorded sounds that align with what others hear. No clue why.[/quote]
Yes, we ourselves are the only ones who never will hear our true own sound. When we hear it played back through speakers it is processed, but that sound is more close to the real sound we produce compared to the mix of sound that travels too our ears through bone and from the room.
/Tom
For some reason, my brain seems to perceive the sounds it detects from my vocal chords or from a horn pressed against my face differently from the recorded sounds that align with what others hear. No clue why.[/quote]
Yes, we ourselves are the only ones who never will hear our true own sound. When we hear it played back through speakers it is processed, but that sound is more close to the real sound we produce compared to the mix of sound that travels too our ears through bone and from the room.
/Tom
- musicofnote
- Posts: 367
- Joined: Jun 03, 2022
content deleted by author