Valve Trombone Ideas?
- SDG
- Posts: 6
- Joined: Dec 11, 2020
I primarily play a large shank slide trombone in orchestra, brass ensemble, brass band, etc. - love the big, warm sound. But I’m in need of a valve trombone that actually sounds like a trombone and not a bass trumpet. Not sure where to start? Used or good vintage okay, what’s my best option under $1000?
Thank you!
Thank you!
- trose02
- Posts: 3
- Joined: Nov 12, 2022
A king 3B valve would be awesome, but you're gonna pay over $1K for one unless you find some kind of crazy deal.
Either a trombonium or a marching trombone could work. They have the same length and conical section as a tenor trombone but not the same form factor as a slide trombone.
The Trombonium was an early marching trombone and the last King instrument developed by H.N.White personally.
You can find more about tromboniums here:[url]https://www.hnwhite.com/Trombonium%20Page.htm
You can still get a great valve trombone from King, Conn, Bach, etc, but they're over $1K used & well over $2K new.
If you want valves and slide trombone form factor under $1K you'll need to look at brands like Stagg, John Parker, Mendini, etc.
When I want valves and a trombone sound I go with a Blessing marching trombone (flugabone).
Guests at jazz gigs are always intrigued when I play this horn and invariably come up to ask "What is that thing?"
- T.
Either a trombonium or a marching trombone could work. They have the same length and conical section as a tenor trombone but not the same form factor as a slide trombone.
The Trombonium was an early marching trombone and the last King instrument developed by H.N.White personally.
You can find more about tromboniums here:
You can still get a great valve trombone from King, Conn, Bach, etc, but they're over $1K used & well over $2K new.
If you want valves and slide trombone form factor under $1K you'll need to look at brands like Stagg, John Parker, Mendini, etc.
When I want valves and a trombone sound I go with a Blessing marching trombone (flugabone).
Guests at jazz gigs are always intrigued when I play this horn and invariably come up to ask "What is that thing?"
- T.
- Matt_K
- Posts: 4809
- Joined: Mar 21, 2018
What's the use case? Depending on why you need it, we might be able to get recommendations that suit you better for what you're going to use it for. W/o that context though, I agree that a flugabone is pretty close to a trombone though I'd never take it to a big band where I was supposed to play a trombone part. Or at least, I would only take it. I did actually have an unusual gig a few years ago that actually called for Flugabone. Actually... 2 flugabones. That guy knew EXACTLY what he wanted though, it worked surprisingly well. (Surrey with the Fring on Top I believe?)
- JohnL
- Posts: 2529
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
If you have the time to wait until one comes on the market, a Conn 90G trombonium might be the way to go for you.
- Posaunus
- Posts: 5018
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
https://reverb.com/item/3368359-king-1130-flugabone
<LINK_TEXT text="https://us.wessex-tubas.com/products/fl ... 961e2723ba">https://us.wessex-tubas.com/products/flugabone-marching-trombone-fb124?shpxid=0c61a021-0de0-4546-a9f5-09961e2723ba</LINK_TEXT>
https://shop.schmittmusic.com/lake-city-415-flugabone/
All less than $1,000.
<LINK_TEXT text="https://us.wessex-tubas.com/products/fl ... 961e2723ba">https://us.wessex-tubas.com/products/flugabone-marching-trombone-fb124?shpxid=0c61a021-0de0-4546-a9f5-09961e2723ba</LINK_TEXT>
https://shop.schmittmusic.com/lake-city-415-flugabone/
All less than $1,000.
- Finetales
- Posts: 1482
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
If you want a valve trombone closest to the sound of your large bore tenor, you'll need a Conn 90G trombonium, Thein valve trombone, or something custom made. The 3B valve trombone is great, but it (like a slide 3B) has a very different sound from a big .547" orchestral tenor. [url=https://www.facebook.com/trombonesrco/videos/724010424317409]This is what a section of 3 of them sounds like playing in an orchestra...it's an AMAZING sound that is way too seldom heard, but you gotta want that sound.
As for the King 1130 flugabone: I have one and love it, and have used it on gigs. However, I can't fathom how anybody could justify paying almost $1k (or more) for one as I've been seeing lately. It is not a particularly refined horn worthy of a 4-figure price tag...anything more than $300 is pushing it IMO. Most of them spent their lives being abused in school marching bands, and that seems to be pretty much what they were designed for. Fun instruments with the right mouthpiece though!
As for the King 1130 flugabone: I have one and love it, and have used it on gigs. However, I can't fathom how anybody could justify paying almost $1k (or more) for one as I've been seeing lately. It is not a particularly refined horn worthy of a 4-figure price tag...anything more than $300 is pushing it IMO. Most of them spent their lives being abused in school marching bands, and that seems to be pretty much what they were designed for. Fun instruments with the right mouthpiece though!
- dukesboneman
- Posts: 935
- Joined: Apr 02, 2018
Finding a Conn Valve trombone would be a better option as they are a .500 bore not a .485 like a King.
- Blabberbucket
- Posts: 305
- Joined: Oct 09, 2022
If you're able to find a valve cluster of the appropriate bore size - maybe from a marching euphonium or something similar - a creative tech ought to be able to source parts and measurements to craft a piston valve section for a large bore instrument similar to what you'll see on a 3B, etc. Between parts, labor, and research, it would likely be expensive but it's an option that I'm sure someone comfortable with doing custom work would be open to taking on.
- iranzi
- Posts: 209
- Joined: Jan 30, 2024
[quote="Finetales"][...] [url=https://www.facebook.com/trombonesrco/videos/724010424317409]This is what a section of 3 of them sounds like playing in an orchestra...it's an AMAZING sound that is way too seldom heard, but you gotta want that sound. [...][/quote]
not completely sure but either the audio is clipping a bit or that's just how 3 small bore valve trombones sound together.
Either way, they sound absolutely amazing and I want to sound just like that! Thank you for posting this. I now have a much better image in my head of the sound i need to be aiming for.
***
Listening now to early Raul de Souza (Raulzinho) and his valve trombone sound does indeed have that warm glow of slight analogue distortion, enveloping a massive prominent core sound. Maybe it's the breadth of the sound that's peculiar — slide trombones tend to sound more focused (speaking from my very limited experience).
Here's 30 seconds of each, Raul de Souza in 1965 & J.J.Johnson in 1992:
<YOUTUBE id="ea238OIbLeg">https://youtu.be/ea238OIbLeg</YOUTUBE>
not completely sure but either the audio is clipping a bit or that's just how 3 small bore valve trombones sound together.
Either way, they sound absolutely amazing and I want to sound just like that! Thank you for posting this. I now have a much better image in my head of the sound i need to be aiming for.
***
Listening now to early Raul de Souza (Raulzinho) and his valve trombone sound does indeed have that warm glow of slight analogue distortion, enveloping a massive prominent core sound. Maybe it's the breadth of the sound that's peculiar — slide trombones tend to sound more focused (speaking from my very limited experience).
Here's 30 seconds of each, Raul de Souza in 1965 & J.J.Johnson in 1992:
<YOUTUBE id="ea238OIbLeg">https://youtu.be/ea238OIbLeg</YOUTUBE>
- timbone
- Posts: 240
- Joined: Apr 30, 2018
I think if it is still made, Getzen made a really good one and their valves are the best. Reminds me of the flugel horn valves.
- Doldom
- Posts: 139
- Joined: May 12, 2018
In my memory Brassark was planning to make some 0.547" valve trombones.
Not sure that it was realized or not.
Not sure that it was realized or not.
- timothy42b
- Posts: 1812
- Joined: Mar 27, 2018
[quote="timbone"]I think if it is still made, Getzen made a really good one and their valves are the best. Reminds me of the flugel horn valves.[/quote]
I have one. It plays well but I couldn't get past the ergonomics. Carpal tunnel would start about ten minutes in.
I have one. It plays well but I couldn't get past the ergonomics. Carpal tunnel would start about ten minutes in.
- Finetales
- Posts: 1482
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
Ergonomics are the big disadvantage to traditionally-wrapped valve trombones. Flugabones are much more comfortable to hold, and are also much more convenient thanks to their compactness and ability to stand it on the bell.
The King trombonium I had was a fabulous player, but also had bad ergonomics and a horribly large factory case. You gotta REALLY want it.
The King trombonium I had was a fabulous player, but also had bad ergonomics and a horribly large factory case. You gotta REALLY want it.
- Wakawaka555
- Posts: 34
- Joined: Jan 06, 2019
I’ve played quite a few valve bones, one of the most open feeling I tried was a Reynolds Contempora (red bell, lots of nickel, and .520 bore). Great horn that I wish I had bought.