Urinetown instrumentation
- Burgerbob
- Posts: 6327
- Joined: Apr 23, 2018
Hey y'all,
I'm playing Urinetown here in a few weeks and I got the book. It's looking like I'll need euphonium (no choice there of course), tenor, bass. I'm cool with that, but it is a lot of stuff to cart around.
Has anyone played it on large tenor? Done the whole thing on .525 maybe? I'll probably use my 608F for the tenor part if I use a bass.
I'm playing Urinetown here in a few weeks and I got the book. It's looking like I'll need euphonium (no choice there of course), tenor, bass. I'm cool with that, but it is a lot of stuff to cart around.
Has anyone played it on large tenor? Done the whole thing on .525 maybe? I'll probably use my 608F for the tenor part if I use a bass.
- CalgaryTbone
- Posts: 1460
- Joined: May 10, 2018
I played it on large tenor and euphonium. It's a little unclear because the part just says Trombone with Bass in parenthesis in just one spot, sort of like a question. There are a few valve notes, but in most cases the composer gives you a choice of octaves. The original run of the show (off-Broadway) was done on large tenor/euph. It's a small band, and usually done in small venues where doubling fees are in short supply. I got an extra fee for the euph., but would have never been able to get a second double, and space was in short supply and the instrument changes are pretty fast. Not sure if the changes to bass would work.
Really fun show with very creative scoring. The trombone covers a lot of styles/range, and while there's nothing higher than a high B flat or C, a tenor sound is a good fit for that. The .547 is a good compromise since it's a big enough sound for the low passages, and there are only 5 or 6 players, so you don't need to push the sound too much in the low stuff. The euphonium has some passages that are typical for the instrument, but some low stuff that is like a small tuba and even some places that are a sub for a french horn. All of the instruments are like that - the reed book has a few instruments, and gets a variety of sounds out of one player. The rest of the players are a rhythm section.
Funny show with a variety of musical styles and some "inside" jokes for the band. Enjoy!
Jim Scott
Really fun show with very creative scoring. The trombone covers a lot of styles/range, and while there's nothing higher than a high B flat or C, a tenor sound is a good fit for that. The .547 is a good compromise since it's a big enough sound for the low passages, and there are only 5 or 6 players, so you don't need to push the sound too much in the low stuff. The euphonium has some passages that are typical for the instrument, but some low stuff that is like a small tuba and even some places that are a sub for a french horn. All of the instruments are like that - the reed book has a few instruments, and gets a variety of sounds out of one player. The rest of the players are a rhythm section.
Funny show with a variety of musical styles and some "inside" jokes for the band. Enjoy!
Jim Scott
- mbarbier
- Posts: 367
- Joined: May 17, 2018
I've done it a few times. The bass portion is doable on tenor. Did the whole trombone part on my 88h/.525.
The euphonium part is pretty easy too (i think it was the first gig I played euph on), but actually quite nice- couple of nice melodies.
It's a really fun one to play. Killer reeds part.
The euphonium part is pretty easy too (i think it was the first gig I played euph on), but actually quite nice- couple of nice melodies.
It's a really fun one to play. Killer reeds part.
- harrisonreed
- Posts: 6479
- Joined: Aug 17, 2018
I just played it with euph and an 88H, when I did that one.
- BGuttman
- Posts: 7368
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
When I did it they asked me to use the bass trombone for the Euph part. Tenor is only called for in one number. Need a Solotone mute for that. They were happy for me to do it on my King 7B alone.
- Doug_Elliott
- Posts: 4155
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
I did it on large tenor, euph, and Eb tuba.... One of the euph tunes is like a bass line and I thought it worked really well on tuba. The trombone part has some low C's and I dealt with that by using the deeper euph mouthpiece for those tunes.
- jacobgarchik
- Posts: 358
- Joined: Oct 27, 2018
bro...always, always, always, play the maximum amount of doubles possible. Do you not get paid a bonus per instrument? Put those carefully negotiated union contracts to work!
- dougm
- Posts: 34
- Joined: Jan 08, 2020
I played the show 5-6 years ago. The venue has concrete block walls (fancy ones), and they had the reed player and me facing the wall. At the first rehearsal it was declared that my euphonium was to loud, blaming the "wall bounce." (I have a double bell euphonium.) But trombone was fine. So I used my small bore tenor and my bass trombone. Perhaps the folks were listening to the loudness levels with their eyes.
- Kdanielsen
- Posts: 609
- Joined: Jul 28, 2019
[quote="dougm"]I played the show 5-6 years ago. The venue has concrete block walls (fancy ones), and they had the reed player and me facing the wall. At the first rehearsal it was declared that my euphonium was to loud, blaming the "wall bounce." (I have a double bell euphonium.) But trombone was fine. So I used my small bore tenor and my bass trombone. Perhaps the folks were listening to the loudness levels with their eyes.[/quote]
Urinetown seems like a great use of the double bell euph! Both horns in one!
Urinetown seems like a great use of the double bell euph! Both horns in one!
- Burgerbob
- Posts: 6327
- Joined: Apr 23, 2018
Thanks for the help, everyone!
I will not be paid for doubles on this- just a high school production.
I have the book and I played through it yesterday... I didn't find those euphonium "tuba" parts, though I was warned by a friend of them as well.
I will not be paid for doubles on this- just a high school production.
I have the book and I played through it yesterday... I didn't find those euphonium "tuba" parts, though I was warned by a friend of them as well.
- CalgaryTbone
- Posts: 1460
- Joined: May 10, 2018
[quote="jacobgarchik"]bro...always, always, always, play the maximum amount of doubles possible. Do you not get paid a bonus per instrument? Put those carefully negotiated union contracts to work![/quote]
This particular book is a little ambiguous about which horns are required, and has it's roots in Off-Broadway where "scales, doubles, etc." are a little dicey. It's always a very small band (well under Broadway minimum numbers) and it doesn't get played in the big theatres with large audience capacity.
When we did it in Calgary, there were union executive board members, including the President (and me) at the time in the band. An appropriate scale was negotiated based on the tariffs and a compromise doubling scale was set (below our usual 50% for the 1st double). The theatre only sat 400 when full, and we were making more than the actors (a tough sell for the producers of the show). It was a fun gig, and was mostly scheduled outside of my symphony season, so I only had to get out of a small amount of orchestra work.
One thing I learned as a member of the Union Exec. here was that it sometimes makes sense to work with local producers and venues to set scales that can guarantee work for our local musicians at a fair scale for that work. The other time I got to do a show that had a tenor/euphonium double was Mary Poppins. It was a National Touring production, and it paid better (including a 50% double). It was, however, a big budget production in a 2500 seat venue with $100 tickets for the audience, and 8 sold-out shows per week.
In our local, we found that small concessions when appropriate cut down on those "play for the door" gigs, or $50 a show under the table scales. The exception was to never compromise on gigs that are part of a National scale - we weren't trying to undercut our colleagues elsewhere. We also always held out for a decent pension scale.
Jim Scott
This particular book is a little ambiguous about which horns are required, and has it's roots in Off-Broadway where "scales, doubles, etc." are a little dicey. It's always a very small band (well under Broadway minimum numbers) and it doesn't get played in the big theatres with large audience capacity.
When we did it in Calgary, there were union executive board members, including the President (and me) at the time in the band. An appropriate scale was negotiated based on the tariffs and a compromise doubling scale was set (below our usual 50% for the 1st double). The theatre only sat 400 when full, and we were making more than the actors (a tough sell for the producers of the show). It was a fun gig, and was mostly scheduled outside of my symphony season, so I only had to get out of a small amount of orchestra work.
One thing I learned as a member of the Union Exec. here was that it sometimes makes sense to work with local producers and venues to set scales that can guarantee work for our local musicians at a fair scale for that work. The other time I got to do a show that had a tenor/euphonium double was Mary Poppins. It was a National Touring production, and it paid better (including a 50% double). It was, however, a big budget production in a 2500 seat venue with $100 tickets for the audience, and 8 sold-out shows per week.
In our local, we found that small concessions when appropriate cut down on those "play for the door" gigs, or $50 a show under the table scales. The exception was to never compromise on gigs that are part of a National scale - we weren't trying to undercut our colleagues elsewhere. We also always held out for a decent pension scale.
Jim Scott
- WilliamLang
- Posts: 636
- Joined: Nov 22, 2019
when Ben Herrington was playing it on broadway he used a .525 for the book.
- Burgerbob
- Posts: 6327
- Joined: Apr 23, 2018
[quote="WilliamLang"]when Ben Herrington was playing it on broadway he used a .525 for the book.[/quote]
I'm thinking it's the right move. My 42T is going to sound pretty heavy on the very tenor-y bits.
I'm thinking it's the right move. My 42T is going to sound pretty heavy on the very tenor-y bits.
- brassmedic
- Posts: 1447
- Joined: Dec 14, 2018
I used a Bach 36 , euph, and I think I brought a bass bone too. Which sucked because there was no room in the pit.
- dougm
- Posts: 34
- Joined: Jan 08, 2020
[quote="Kdanielsen"]Urinetown seems like a great use of the double bell euph! Both horns in one![/quote]
Sort of what I was initially thinking. Not what those in charge thought in the end.
Not to get off topic, but I was hired once to play Ragtime, but money was tight, so they only hired me to attend the last rehearsal before the show run. I showed up, saw two rows of chairs in the back, and asked where I was supposed to sit. A violinist friend of mine said "take your pick." I said no, I did not want to take someone else's chair. She responded that one chair was the tuba players chair, and the show director came to the pit on Monday and fired him, and a second chair was for the trumpet player, but the show director fired him last night. So, Ragtime with one brass player - me.
Doug
Sort of what I was initially thinking. Not what those in charge thought in the end.
Not to get off topic, but I was hired once to play Ragtime, but money was tight, so they only hired me to attend the last rehearsal before the show run. I showed up, saw two rows of chairs in the back, and asked where I was supposed to sit. A violinist friend of mine said "take your pick." I said no, I did not want to take someone else's chair. She responded that one chair was the tuba players chair, and the show director came to the pit on Monday and fired him, and a second chair was for the trumpet player, but the show director fired him last night. So, Ragtime with one brass player - me.
Doug
- Blabberbucket
- Posts: 305
- Joined: Oct 09, 2022
Assuming you've got a decent trigger range, this show is fine on tenor and euph only. I've done it twice, one with a .547 tenor, and the second time on a 3BF. I feel the smaller horn worked better in such a small ensemble. Depending on the space and how sound is being run, something like a marching euphonium may be more effective (ie, not having to have separate microphones for trombone and euph)
- Burgerbob
- Posts: 6327
- Joined: Apr 23, 2018
[quote="Blabberbucket"]Assuming you've got a decent trigger range, this show is fine on tenor and euph only. I've done it twice, one with a .547 tenor, and the second time on a 3BF. I feel the smaller horn worked better in such a small ensemble. Depending on the space and how sound is being run, something like a marching euphonium may be more effective (ie, not having to have separate microphones for trombone and euph)[/quote]
Don't give me any ideas... I have a marching baritone sitting around!
Don't give me any ideas... I have a marching baritone sitting around!
- CalgaryTbone
- Posts: 1460
- Joined: May 10, 2018
The horn changes are fast if I recall - I think I played a couple of licks on the wrong horn just to make things work.
- Aznguyy
- Posts: 664
- Joined: May 01, 2018
I played most of it on my .508 yamaha but for the meatier low parts(end of act 1) I used my 547. Using a bass was always too heavy and you would have to bring two sets of mutes. I did play it once with a Bass but in that situation, everything was running through a mix and we were in our own room, not in the pit. I did also used a Marching Euphonium. SO MUCH EASIER WITH ALL THE SWITCHES!!! The sound guys/gals always loved it.
- Burgerbob
- Posts: 6327
- Joined: Apr 23, 2018
in the final bit of dress rehearsals for the production. In the first read I settled on .525 (King 608F) and euphonium. 608F has plenty of beef for the low Cs, and I haven't had any trouble changing horns.
The book is ok... Plenty of notes, but I have definitely played more fulfilling parts in shows.
The book is ok... Plenty of notes, but I have definitely played more fulfilling parts in shows.
- JKBone85
- Posts: 78
- Joined: Jul 26, 2022
I've played multiple productions and it is one of my favorite books, especially if you've got a good reed player playing that book. 1 trombone and 1 euph is all I've ever used on it. At times my daily horn was a .547 and at times it's been a .525 and the book has been fine on both. Hail Malthus!