Tangents on Lassus Conundrum
- BaronVonBone
- Posts: 36
- Joined: Feb 20, 2023
[quote="brassmedic"]<QUOTE author="BaronVonBone" post_id="205651" time="1679628154" user_id="16315">TheWhoWhatNow did I say!?
Never said we had to respect anyone's opinions, just others--people, and to the extent that they haven't spent their burden of doubt, at which point there but for the vagaries of the cosmos go I comes into play.[/quote]
I didn't say you said that. What you said was, "others are deserving of respect whether they agree with us or not", and I said they are NOT deserving of respect IF their opinions are immoral. What's complicated about that?
Oh, I see - you're nitpicking that I said "people's opinions" and you said "people". Um... ok - I don't agree that we have to respect people who hold immoral opinions. Obvious example: I don't respect Hitler. Is that more clear to you now?</QUOTE>
It's actually very natural, in person, to distinguish between the person and the person's opinions, particularly if the person has earned a high degree of respect in certain ways/paradigms--say, an extraordinary musician. But there's also an important distinction between disagreement and immorality, which is also a lot easier to make in person--at least for most healthy human brains.
I was talking about opinions we disagree with. When the shift from we disagree to that's immoral takes place depends upon how quickly someone decides a difference of opinion is immoral, and again, that's when the benefit of reasonable doubt and there but for the grace/vagaries of God/the cosmos go I<I> comes in ... <I>even in a case like Hitler (or Trump).
I'm certainly not suggesting Hitler (et al) are off the hook because of their unfortunate background baggage, and I understand, very easily understand, how people have a hard time giving even a kind of technical benefit of doubt. I wouldn't claim it's easy, or that it always works. But at least understanding how a human brain went awry in such extreme ways is arguably as good as can be done in such cases. It also shifts the human brain considering these things into a more objective and clinical mode, derailing (at least somewhat) hatred and other related toxins to intellectual functioning.</I></I>
Never said we had to respect anyone's opinions, just others--people, and to the extent that they haven't spent their burden of doubt, at which point there but for the vagaries of the cosmos go I comes into play.[/quote]
I didn't say you said that. What you said was, "others are deserving of respect whether they agree with us or not", and I said they are NOT deserving of respect IF their opinions are immoral. What's complicated about that?
Oh, I see - you're nitpicking that I said "people's opinions" and you said "people". Um... ok - I don't agree that we have to respect people who hold immoral opinions. Obvious example: I don't respect Hitler. Is that more clear to you now?</QUOTE>
It's actually very natural, in person, to distinguish between the person and the person's opinions, particularly if the person has earned a high degree of respect in certain ways/paradigms--say, an extraordinary musician. But there's also an important distinction between disagreement and immorality, which is also a lot easier to make in person--at least for most healthy human brains.
I was talking about opinions we disagree with. When the shift from we disagree to that's immoral takes place depends upon how quickly someone decides a difference of opinion is immoral, and again, that's when the benefit of reasonable doubt and there but for the grace/vagaries of God/the cosmos go I<I> comes in ... <I>even in a case like Hitler (or Trump).
I'm certainly not suggesting Hitler (et al) are off the hook because of their unfortunate background baggage, and I understand, very easily understand, how people have a hard time giving even a kind of technical benefit of doubt. I wouldn't claim it's easy, or that it always works. But at least understanding how a human brain went awry in such extreme ways is arguably as good as can be done in such cases. It also shifts the human brain considering these things into a more objective and clinical mode, derailing (at least somewhat) hatred and other related toxins to intellectual functioning.</I></I>