Mystery Bach Trombone
- EOlson9
- Posts: 130
- Joined: Apr 19, 2018
Hey all. I've come across this interesting Bach trombone and I'm curious what it is. It seems very reminiscent of a Bach TB200B or a Bach Omega, but has a very simple Bach engraving on the bell, as well as a more King-style attachment between the slide and bell. Also, it has a 7.5" bell. Can anyone help me with what model this instrument is?
- EOlson9
- Posts: 130
- Joined: Apr 19, 2018
Other than the simple engraving, it looks to be a Mercedes. Every picture of a Mercedes I can find shows a more elaborate engraving on the bell.
- Elow
- Posts: 1924
- Joined: Mar 02, 2020
It’s an intermediate model. I used a newer version of this years ago
- Doug_Elliott
- Posts: 4155
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
What's with that strange trigger placement?
- dukesboneman
- Posts: 935
- Joined: Apr 02, 2018
That sure looks like a Mercedes. We had some of these where I used to teach
- Burgerbob
- Posts: 6327
- Joined: Apr 23, 2018
real talk- if you got it for cheap and you measure that span of the tuning slide... I'd love to get that F attachment.
- EOlson9
- Posts: 130
- Joined: Apr 19, 2018
It's not mine to sell. Someone brought it into the store I work at and wanted to sell it to us. We couldn't identify it ourselves, so I thought I'd reach out here.
- atopper333
- Posts: 377
- Joined: Mar 09, 2022
It is a Bach TB200B intermediate horn.
Here is a link:
<LINK_TEXT text="https://www.altomusic.com/products/bach ... gLiI_D_BwE">https://www.altomusic.com/products/bach-model-tb200b-bb-f-tenor-trombone-with-f-rotor-c01?variant=46168028315931&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIg-79xNq1hQMVOzbUAR0E9woHEAQYASABEgLiI_D_BwE</LINK_TEXT>
A search of the model number will give you photos with the same bell engraving, ring rest, and trigger placement.
Here is a link:
<LINK_TEXT text="https://www.altomusic.com/products/bach ... gLiI_D_BwE">https://www.altomusic.com/products/bach-model-tb200b-bb-f-tenor-trombone-with-f-rotor-c01?variant=46168028315931&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIg-79xNq1hQMVOzbUAR0E9woHEAQYASABEgLiI_D_BwE</LINK_TEXT>
A search of the model number will give you photos with the same bell engraving, ring rest, and trigger placement.
- Burgerbob
- Posts: 6327
- Joined: Apr 23, 2018
[quote="atopper333"]It is a Bach TB200B intermediate horn.
Here is a link:
<LINK_TEXT text="https://www.altomusic.com/products/bach ... gLiI_D_BwE">https://www.altomusic.com/products/bach-model-tb200b-bb-f-tenor-trombone-with-f-rotor-c01?variant=46168028315931&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIg-79xNq1hQMVOzbUAR0E9woHEAQYASABEgLiI_D_BwE</LINK_TEXT>
A search of the model number will give you photos with the same bell engraving, ring rest, and trigger placement.[/quote]
This is a smaller instrument- the TB200B is an intermediate 36. This horn has a 7.5" bell and a narrower span.
Here is a link:
<LINK_TEXT text="https://www.altomusic.com/products/bach ... gLiI_D_BwE">https://www.altomusic.com/products/bach-model-tb200b-bb-f-tenor-trombone-with-f-rotor-c01?variant=46168028315931&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIg-79xNq1hQMVOzbUAR0E9woHEAQYASABEgLiI_D_BwE</LINK_TEXT>
A search of the model number will give you photos with the same bell engraving, ring rest, and trigger placement.[/quote]
This is a smaller instrument- the TB200B is an intermediate 36. This horn has a 7.5" bell and a narrower span.
- atopper333
- Posts: 377
- Joined: Mar 09, 2022
[quote="Burgerbob"]<QUOTE author="atopper333" post_id="240010" time="1712685637" user_id="15001">
It is a Bach TB200B intermediate horn.
Here is a link:
<LINK_TEXT text="https://www.altomusic.com/products/bach ... gLiI_D_BwE">https://www.altomusic.com/products/bach-model-tb200b-bb-f-tenor-trombone-with-f-rotor-c01?variant=46168028315931&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIg-79xNq1hQMVOzbUAR0E9woHEAQYASABEgLiI_D_BwE</LINK_TEXT>
A search of the model number will give you photos with the same bell engraving, ring rest, and trigger placement.[/quote]
This is a smaller instrument- the TB200B is an intermediate 36. This horn has a 7.5" bell and a narrower span.
</QUOTE>
Completely missed that bell…let alone the receiver…that looks like a King style receiver/tenon…now I’m completely confused…
It is a Bach TB200B intermediate horn.
Here is a link:
<LINK_TEXT text="https://www.altomusic.com/products/bach ... gLiI_D_BwE">https://www.altomusic.com/products/bach-model-tb200b-bb-f-tenor-trombone-with-f-rotor-c01?variant=46168028315931&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIg-79xNq1hQMVOzbUAR0E9woHEAQYASABEgLiI_D_BwE</LINK_TEXT>
A search of the model number will give you photos with the same bell engraving, ring rest, and trigger placement.[/quote]
This is a smaller instrument- the TB200B is an intermediate 36. This horn has a 7.5" bell and a narrower span.
</QUOTE>
Completely missed that bell…let alone the receiver…that looks like a King style receiver/tenon…now I’m completely confused…
- atopper333
- Posts: 377
- Joined: Mar 09, 2022
Wrong bell engraving as well. Perhaps a F attachment trombone ordered off of AliExpress with a Bach logo?
- EOlson9
- Posts: 130
- Joined: Apr 19, 2018
Looks like it is just a Mercedes II. Found a couple of other images online of a Mercedes II with the same bell engraving and case. Thanks for the assist everyone.
- ithinknot
- Posts: 1339
- Joined: Jul 24, 2020
The model goes way back: <LINK_TEXT text="https://www.thebrass-exchange.com/conte ... 508-bore-f">https://www.thebrass-exchange.com/content/bach-mercedes-vintage-508-bore-f</LINK_TEXT>
There are things in this world that are hard to explain... the double reversed tuning slide might be one of them.
There are things in this world that are hard to explain... the double reversed tuning slide might be one of them.
- Finetales
- Posts: 1482
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
Funnily enough, it's not even the only Bach model with a King receiver:
[quote="jorymil"]To the 3B/606 sizes, add the Bach (yes, you read that right!) Liberty. Conn-Selmer must have been doing some experimenting in the early days of the merger, and put out a Bach-stamped horn with a King-style bell tenon and nut. Classic Bach-style dual-radius slide; all nickel-silver.
Not all Bach Liberty horns have the slide-side nut, but those that do use the same nut/tenon/receiver as a King 606.[/quote]
Being as this Mercedes is apparently a .508" bore according to that Brass Exchange ad, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it's compatible with a 3B. I never knew Bach made a 3BF-style horn!
[quote="jorymil"]To the 3B/606 sizes, add the Bach (yes, you read that right!) Liberty. Conn-Selmer must have been doing some experimenting in the early days of the merger, and put out a Bach-stamped horn with a King-style bell tenon and nut. Classic Bach-style dual-radius slide; all nickel-silver.
Not all Bach Liberty horns have the slide-side nut, but those that do use the same nut/tenon/receiver as a King 606.[/quote]
Being as this Mercedes is apparently a .508" bore according to that Brass Exchange ad, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it's compatible with a 3B. I never knew Bach made a 3BF-style horn!
- Burgerbob
- Posts: 6327
- Joined: Apr 23, 2018
That slide assembly is looking awfully similar to the 76H I just posted.
- EOlson9
- Posts: 130
- Joined: Apr 19, 2018
[quote="Finetales"]Funnily enough, it's not even the only Bach model with a King receiver:
<QUOTE author="jorymil" post_id="173018" time="1646430679" user_id="7947">
To the 3B/606 sizes, add the Bach (yes, you read that right!) Liberty. Conn-Selmer must have been doing some experimenting in the early days of the merger, and put out a Bach-stamped horn with a King-style bell tenon and nut. Classic Bach-style dual-radius slide; all nickel-silver.
Not all Bach Liberty horns have the slide-side nut, but those that do use the same nut/tenon/receiver as a King 606.[/quote]
Being as this Mercedes is apparently a .508" bore according to that Brass Exchange ad, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it's compatible with a 3B. I never knew Bach made a 3BF-style horn!
</QUOTE>
Everything I found on the Mercedes shows it to be a .510 bore, not .508. Odd size, I know.
<QUOTE author="jorymil" post_id="173018" time="1646430679" user_id="7947">
To the 3B/606 sizes, add the Bach (yes, you read that right!) Liberty. Conn-Selmer must have been doing some experimenting in the early days of the merger, and put out a Bach-stamped horn with a King-style bell tenon and nut. Classic Bach-style dual-radius slide; all nickel-silver.
Not all Bach Liberty horns have the slide-side nut, but those that do use the same nut/tenon/receiver as a King 606.[/quote]
Being as this Mercedes is apparently a .508" bore according to that Brass Exchange ad, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it's compatible with a 3B. I never knew Bach made a 3BF-style horn!
</QUOTE>
Everything I found on the Mercedes shows it to be a .510 bore, not .508. Odd size, I know.
- octavposaune
- Posts: 160
- Joined: Jul 04, 2018
Hi all,
I dug out my 30yo Bach parts catalog and found the model number. Its an 894B intermediate model trombone. I think its made of French Selmer trombone parts, or maybe an obsolete Beuscher model. The throat is extra large and 1970s versions had a super wide slide crook, which was inspriation for my having wide glides fabricated back in the early teens. So, yes this is a later version on the Mercedes 1 f attachment instruments that started in the 70s. Mercedes II were cheaper 36s and were a great deal when found used...
Benn
I dug out my 30yo Bach parts catalog and found the model number. Its an 894B intermediate model trombone. I think its made of French Selmer trombone parts, or maybe an obsolete Beuscher model. The throat is extra large and 1970s versions had a super wide slide crook, which was inspriation for my having wide glides fabricated back in the early teens. So, yes this is a later version on the Mercedes 1 f attachment instruments that started in the 70s. Mercedes II were cheaper 36s and were a great deal when found used...
Benn
- elmsandr
- Posts: 1373
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
/kicks tires
So, uh, what’s the rotor bore and tubing here? Should it it graft on to a 16?
Cheers,
Andy
So, uh, what’s the rotor bore and tubing here? Should it it graft on to a 16?
Cheers,
Andy