preferences in sideways shifted embouchures
- stevenvortigern
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Jan 26, 2023
For all the players out there that play with an off-centered embouchure, it is more common to shift to the left than the right?
I'm wondering if there in analogy to handedness here. The idea is that since more people are right handed, this could correlate to a more common preference to go to the left with the mouthpiece. This would actually require more control from the right side of the face, since a larger section of the lip on the right must stay firm, unaided by contact with the mouthpiece, to maintain a buzz.
Are there any left handed players that shift to the right with the mouthpiece?
I'm wondering if there in analogy to handedness here. The idea is that since more people are right handed, this could correlate to a more common preference to go to the left with the mouthpiece. This would actually require more control from the right side of the face, since a larger section of the lip on the right must stay firm, unaided by contact with the mouthpiece, to maintain a buzz.
Are there any left handed players that shift to the right with the mouthpiece?
- Matt_K
- Posts: 4809
- Joined: Mar 21, 2018
I'm left handed. My "pivot" is high range is up and to the right, low range is down and to the left.
- fourtissimo
- Posts: 3
- Joined: Jul 09, 2023
Right-handed, embouchure is shifted to the right. It looks like the muscles on the opposite side of the face are more engaged, so my left corner "looks" firmer. Only problem is if I want to play with the bell to the left of my music stand, my eyes have to look pretty far off-axis compared to someone who is centered or left shifted :(
- AtomicClock
- Posts: 1094
- Joined: Oct 19, 2023
I'm left-handed and left-eyed. I keep the mouthpiece centered left-to-right. But I suspect I keep more pressure on one side, to unconsciously move the tip of the slide toward the center of my left eye's field of view.
- MTbassbone
- Posts: 558
- Joined: Apr 21, 2018
I am mainly right handed (I bat and golf left handed) and I play left (my left) of center. Like Matt K my high range is up and to the right and the low range is down and to the left. Personally, I don't focus as much of the movement from side to side (especially when ascending) but more up and down. Everyone is different.
- Burgerbob
- Posts: 6327
- Joined: Apr 23, 2018
Right handed and mine is shifted to the left a bit. I think it's primarily from starting on euphonium, also a non-ergonomic instrument.
- andym
- Posts: 127
- Joined: Dec 23, 2018
I’m right handed and play a good bit to the right. Always thought it is due to ergonomics of starting when it was hard to reach long positions. But I also started on baritone and don’t remember what that did to me. I’ve tried playing on center and it just doesn’t work for me. So it could also be the shape of my mouth.
- hyperbolica
- Posts: 3990
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
Shift to the right may be more due to left handed asymmetrical trombone grip. I'm right handed, and mpc is placed slightly to my right.
- Wilktone
- Posts: 720
- Joined: Mar 27, 2018
An off center mouthpiece placement has more to do with the player's anatomy than neurological or genetic reasons (like handedness does). Orthodontics, for example, can alter where a musician's mouthpiece placement works best.
I haven't looked at off center placement statistically, so I'm just guessing, but I don't really see one side being favored. Vertical placement, however, does clearly show more players play best with a higher mouthpiece placement.
For what it's worth, my placement is off to my left and rather low. To ascend I pull down and to my left, up and to the right to descend. I'm left handed, but play trombone right handed.
Dave
I haven't looked at off center placement statistically, so I'm just guessing, but I don't really see one side being favored. Vertical placement, however, does clearly show more players play best with a higher mouthpiece placement.
For what it's worth, my placement is off to my left and rather low. To ascend I pull down and to my left, up and to the right to descend. I'm left handed, but play trombone right handed.
Dave
- tbdana
- Posts: 1928
- Joined: Apr 08, 2023
I'm right-handed, and for many years I played shifted to the right.
But when I started back up a little over a year ago after 30 years off, it was like starting all over again, so I chose to keep my embouchure centered now. Works just as well. I don't know if the sideways shift makes any difference at all beyond being a comfortable habit.
But when I started back up a little over a year ago after 30 years off, it was like starting all over again, so I chose to keep my embouchure centered now. Works just as well. I don't know if the sideways shift makes any difference at all beyond being a comfortable habit.
- stevenvortigern
- Posts: 25
- Joined: Jan 26, 2023
Thanks for all the responses. I was mainly asking about shifting the mouthpiece to one side or the other rather than up or down with range changes. It appears that there are a lot of reasons players postulate for having a mouthpiece side shift and, from this small sample, there really isn't a correlation with handedness.
I am right handed and used to play with the mouthpiece to the left, but have recently have moved it to the center. I am noticing greater ease, smoother connection and bigger sound in the mid register, but I am going to have to relearn the upper and lower registers. I have a greater feeling of control and stability from my right face, as I do with my right hand vs left. My right side facial muscles also appear bigger. I'm curious to see if my left side face muscles will visibly change as I learn to rely on them more.
I am right handed and used to play with the mouthpiece to the left, but have recently have moved it to the center. I am noticing greater ease, smoother connection and bigger sound in the mid register, but I am going to have to relearn the upper and lower registers. I have a greater feeling of control and stability from my right face, as I do with my right hand vs left. My right side facial muscles also appear bigger. I'm curious to see if my left side face muscles will visibly change as I learn to rely on them more.
- andym
- Posts: 127
- Joined: Dec 23, 2018
I didn’t answer the handedness part. I’m right-handed and, as I mentioned above, shift to the right.
- Burgerbob
- Posts: 6327
- Joined: Apr 23, 2018
As Doug Elliot will tell you, rarely does an embouchure pivot only in one plane.
- Doug_Elliott
- Posts: 4155
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
Where you place the mouthpieces is, or at least should be, related to where everything works best. That is a function of teeth structure, not handedness or comfort or strength on one side or the other.
I am right handed and played pretty much in the middle for my first 25 or so years of playing. Then I discovered that EVERYTHING works better quite a bit to my left and that's where I am now.
I am right handed and played pretty much in the middle for my first 25 or so years of playing. Then I discovered that EVERYTHING works better quite a bit to my left and that's where I am now.
- Kbiggs
- Posts: 1768
- Joined: Mar 24, 2018
Started out centered. Was even complimented in college for my “textbook” embouchure. Too many years later and I now play slightly to the right, and on a larger mouthpiece than I thought I could handle. I ascend and move to the right, and I descend down and to the left, about 1 o’clock and 7 o’clock respectively. Works better than anything else I’ve tried.
Thanks, Doug.
Thanks, Doug.
- timothy42b
- Posts: 1812
- Joined: Mar 27, 2018
Back in the late 70s I talked to someone who taught in the Chicago area. He thought our embouchure should center on what he called the "crown tooth," usually the most forward of the front teeth. He told me my left front tooth was the crown tooth and so I should be playing slightly left of center.
He also believed teeth alignment that is more straight across favored mellow instruments, and those which angled more sharply forward (seen from above) should play more brilliant ones like trumpet and trombone. And now I may have already said too much.
He also believed teeth alignment that is more straight across favored mellow instruments, and those which angled more sharply forward (seen from above) should play more brilliant ones like trumpet and trombone. And now I may have already said too much.
- Savio
- Posts: 688
- Joined: Apr 26, 2018
I have a 11 years old talented player i teach on trumpet. She and her family are very much involved in the local music community and she practice. She play way to the left side of her mouth, but still sounds good as an 11 years old child. I thought maybe try to make her embouchure more centred. The reason was articulation was not good and sound a little thin. But still talented and play a lot.
The articulation became more clear. Sound more fuzzy but still bigger. But I still didn't want to make a decision. Since I'm not good in embouchure problems I sent her to one of the best trumpet teacher's around. The 11 years old kid come back and told she has made a decision. Play with mouthpiece in center. I asked the mother and father to join the lesson. Told them all this will take time and patience. And to do basic, buzzing on mouthpiece, simple exersise like slur from G to C. Tounge exercise in middle register with da da articulation.
She liked to play even a light version of Haydn trumpet concerto before. Any tips from people who have done this before with younger kids? I don't want to loose her because she is talented and have a lot of music inside.
Leif
The articulation became more clear. Sound more fuzzy but still bigger. But I still didn't want to make a decision. Since I'm not good in embouchure problems I sent her to one of the best trumpet teacher's around. The 11 years old kid come back and told she has made a decision. Play with mouthpiece in center. I asked the mother and father to join the lesson. Told them all this will take time and patience. And to do basic, buzzing on mouthpiece, simple exersise like slur from G to C. Tounge exercise in middle register with da da articulation.
She liked to play even a light version of Haydn trumpet concerto before. Any tips from people who have done this before with younger kids? I don't want to loose her because she is talented and have a lot of music inside.
Leif
- Wilktone
- Posts: 720
- Joined: Mar 27, 2018
[quote="Savio"]Any tips from people who have done this before with younger kids? I don't want to loose her because she is talented and have a lot of music inside.[/quote]
I"m not sure I would have recommended she change to a more centered mouthpiece placement, but at 11 years old I probably wouldn't worry about her mouthpiece placement too much anyway. She's still going to be growing. Does she have all her permanent teeth in yet? I assume that her wisdom teeth haven't grown in yet, and that can cause things to shift as well. At her age I think it's more important to make sure she's holding the instrument correctly and consistently and her playing posture is also consistently good.
But in general, I find that if someone naturally gravitates to an off center mouthpiece placement there's usually a good reason why.
If articulations are not so good with an off center placement you can have the student try tonguing on the other side of their mouth. So if the placement is on the left, their tongue tip will strike towards the right. Everyone is different, but this can sometimes help clean up articulations.
Dave
I"m not sure I would have recommended she change to a more centered mouthpiece placement, but at 11 years old I probably wouldn't worry about her mouthpiece placement too much anyway. She's still going to be growing. Does she have all her permanent teeth in yet? I assume that her wisdom teeth haven't grown in yet, and that can cause things to shift as well. At her age I think it's more important to make sure she's holding the instrument correctly and consistently and her playing posture is also consistently good.
But in general, I find that if someone naturally gravitates to an off center mouthpiece placement there's usually a good reason why.
If articulations are not so good with an off center placement you can have the student try tonguing on the other side of their mouth. So if the placement is on the left, their tongue tip will strike towards the right. Everyone is different, but this can sometimes help clean up articulations.
Dave
- drewcoraccio
- Posts: 5
- Joined: Dec 14, 2024
Reading these replies it’s reassuring to know an off centered embouchure is not an immediate red flag! I’ve been playing shifted to the right for a number of years now and have been trying to figure out why directly centered just does not work the same for me. I just followed where I found I developed the best sound, and to me that is slightly off centered. In my next practice session I’ll have to see if this has a pattern when moving to the high/low range of the horn.