Who are the Shires .525 players out there and what’s your setup?

I’ve always respected and appreciated Shires equipment but have never been super excited about any horn I’ve tried. However, I recently acquired a .525 TW25 slide and am really loving playing it. I don’t have an 8” bell, so I’ve only tried it with my 8.5” TII 5YVNY bell, and it works really well. The sound has a lot of character and color to it like a larger Bach 36. It feels like a good balance between Bach character with modern playability. Would love to see what others have experimented with and discovered.

Years ago I tried an all-rose brass (what Shires calls gold brass) straight Shires .525 at ETW, which was by far the best and most characterful Shires I've ever played. I wish I had written down all the specs at the time, it was very special.

I bought that Shires/Williams hybrid that Noah had on his site (<LINK_TEXT text="https://brassark.com/sale_horns/custom- ... -trombone/">https://brassark.com/sale_horns/custom-earl-williams-shires-model-9-tenor-trombone/</LINK_TEXT>). It originally came paired with a Q series .547” slide, but I ended up buying a T25NLW slide from Doug at Brass Exchange. I paired it with the MRS leadpipe and it is simply phenomenal. I’m not much of a large bore player so going with the medium slide was ideal for me, plus it’s more in line with the Williams 9 I was previously playing. The hybrid sports an original 9” Burbank Williams bell and I’ve been using my Mt.V 3 with it.

If I was buying a Shires medium blind I’d get a 7YLW8 bell (I actually have one at the moment but it’s paired with a Getzen bell section and slide) with a dual bore rotor and a T0825YLW slide. If I were using it for classical I’d go TW2547LW and probably the 8.5” version of the bell.

I’ve owned some combination of most of those over the years. The 7 type bells are a really nice compromise. And I really like Shires dual bore slides. I had a T0825GLW that was one of the best slides I’ve ever had though I didn’t use it much because I had larger and smaller slides that worked better for much of what I was doing at the time, although now I mainly play a custom 500/525 slide.

When I spec'd out my large bore Shires build, I ordered both .547 and .525 slides to pair with it. I had originally planned to use both slides with an 8.5" bell, but they had a magical 8" sterling bell finished around the time my 8.5" bell was ready to spin - when they offered it up, I couldn't say no (glad I didn't, because it is awesome). Both slides are wide crook, with light weight nickel outers. The nickel slide balances out the sterling bell nicely, and the setup is very flexible. With aftermarket options for one-off cut bell flares with Shires-compatible threaded rings (O'Malley and Butler are a couple that come to mind, but there are probably others), it might be interesting at some point to carry a cut bell, with both 8" and 8.5" flare options. There are some interesting nuances to the sound and response differences in combining a medium bore slide with a larger bell as compared to a large bore slide with a smaller flare.

I am.

Essentially a Q30 bell, stripped, flare detached and then satin finished (after hours work done by myself) TY with standard counterweight touching the upper leg ferrule, Q30 Rotor, T25NLW with a Bollinger collar, using an M2 leadpipe. I like a small shank. This is the setup I use most often. I find it responds very quickly, and is very flexible in timbre. It can be dark or bright when I need it. Most often I'm playing with a Rock/R&B band, and it can support the trumpet player when he's ripping and I'm written an octave under him. It can provide similar weight to the bari sax player, so I can support him an octave below for anything below his low A, which is our low C, so anything in the pedal register. Beyond the handslide, it's a large bore tenor, so it can made to sound like a bass. I also find this setup blends really well with the alto and tenor in the section, and with such a quick response, I can articulate closer to what they do on stabs and baps.

I acquired this set up in 2005 after spending the better part of the day at the Hopedale shop: 1G8 bell, a T25 light weight slide with brass outer slides, nickel crook. The valve section is a Shires dual bore that I bought on the internet* a few years later. A few months after they sent me the horn, Shires recalled and repaired the slide. A problem with the jig they said. Overall it’s been a bit of a disappointment.

I went to Hopedale thinking I’d be interested in a Conn 78-type horn, but after trying everything they had, including a horn they put together for Sam Burtis, this is what we came up with.

I initially bought a Trubore but sold it a few years later when money got tight.

I've been playing a 7YLW8 bell with a dual bore valve and a T25NLW slide for the last 9 years. I purchased it new while working on cruise ships as I often found myself needing a valve during guest entertainer shows. Its a workhorse commercial horn, with a bright core, centered feel and clear articulations. You can fine tune the horn for different styles/shows by using different mouthpieces. It works well in most settings and was my only horn for 5 or 6 years.

I do feel like I'm still searching for the right lead pipe. As of now I have a small shank 1 and 1.5 pipe and a large shank 2. The large bore pipe does not work at all with the horn. The #1 is pretty tight and works well for jazz and pop music but just doesn't really get broad enough for more 'legit' numbers. I'm not a big fan of the #1.5, it feels too unstable to me while still being too narrow. Eventually I'd like to try out a small shank #2 or a Brad Close MV36 or 78H

[quote="slidefunk"]I do feel like I'm still searching for the right lead pipe.[/quote]

Both the 78H and MV36 pipes from Brad Close are excellent, and I don't think you'd go wrong either way. I also quite liked the Ralph Sauer pipes in my dual bore .525/.547 slide. I let those go when I traded away that slide, but just recently received a new small shank version in nickel (RSMN), which I'm looking forward to trying out in my TW25NLW.

[quote="muschem"]<QUOTE author="slidefunk" post_id="264964" time="1737665000" user_id="10403">
I do feel like I'm still searching for the right lead pipe.[/quote]

Both the 78H and MV36 pipes from Brad Close are excellent, and I don't think you'd go wrong either way. I also quite liked the Ralph Sauer pipes in my dual bore .525/.547 slide. I let those go when I traded away that slide, but just recently received a new small shank version in nickel (RSMN), which I'm looking forward to trying out in my TW25NLW.
</QUOTE>

I love the MRS pipe with my T25NLW. I have the standard brass version so definitely looking forward to hearing your thoughts on the nickel version!

[quote="HawaiiTromboneGuy"]<QUOTE author="muschem" post_id="264969" time="1737666122" user_id="11185">

Both the 78H and MV36 pipes from Brad Close are excellent, and I don't think you'd go wrong either way. I also quite liked the Ralph Sauer pipes in my dual bore .525/.547 slide. I let those go when I traded away that slide, but just recently received a new small shank version in nickel (RSMN), which I'm looking forward to trying out in my TW25NLW.[/quote]

I love the MRS pipe with my T25NLW. I have the standard brass version so definitely looking forward to hearing your thoughts on the nickel version!
</QUOTE>

I was curious, so I gave it a spin last night a bit, going back and forth between my MV36 and the Sauer pipe, both in drawn nickel. I wanted to share my early impressions, with the usual caveats - ymmv.

I know not everyone is a fan of nickel, but I find it usually works very well in my setups. My sterling bells have a very dense sound, favoring the fundamental with fewer overtones. I find that nickel adds back some of the brilliance/sparkle to the sound, so it doesn't come across as too heavy or dull. That said, some leadpipe designs emphasize aspects of the material that can be a bit overbearing for some playing styles... "brittle" or "harsh" are terms that come to mind when this happens at the extreme end.

For me, the MV36 design in nickel threads the sonic needle very well - the dial is perhaps tuned toward the far end of the spectrum, but without actually crossing over into that "brittle" territory. It is very focused, with a penetrating quality to the sound that really sings up high. A great commercial sound. With that as a baseline against which to draw comparisons, the Sauer pipe in nickel turns that sonic dial away from the far end and more toward a middle ground. It rounds off the edges that can feel a bit sharp sometimes on the 36, without giving up too much of the upper overtones and sparkle. It feels like it would be easier to blend the sound in a section (sometimes challenging with nickel pipes), and perhaps it would be more suited to a wind ensemble or orchestral setting (to be clear, the MV36 is a great pipe in those settings too... just maybe in a different material, or combination of materials than I was using last night). It has a really nice character to the sound , which reminded me of this quote:

“The Hitch-Hiker's Guide to the Galaxy also mentions alcohol. It says that the best drink in existence is the Pan Galactic Gargle Blaster, the effect of which is like having your brains smashed out with a slice of lemon wrapped round a large gold brick.”

― Douglas Adams, The Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy

"Slice of lemon..." - for sure, there is still that 'bright' character that nickel imparts, but also "....wrapped round a large gold brick" - yeah, that's harder to quantify, but I'd say there is a certain weight to the sound, but with softer edges. I dig it, tbh. I need to get it out of the practice room and into a larger hall and rehearsal settings to form an opinion with more context, but I'm a fan so far.

Thanks all for your responses! I've enjoyed reading them and getting to know more about different setups. Has anyone tried the 8" version of the VNY bell or a #1? I saw a few of those on the used market in recent months. I almost pulled the trigger on one but was too late to the draw.

[quote="Lhbone"]Thanks all for your responses! I've enjoyed reading them and getting to know more about different setups. Has anyone tried the 8" version of the VNY bell or a #1? I saw a few of those on the used market in recent months. I almost pulled the trigger on one but was too late to the draw.[/quote]

I’ve had a Shires .525 in various forms for a while now. Started with 7YLW 8.5 bell with TW25 slide and dual bore rotor. It was good but felt like it redlined a little quickly and lacked a little focus. I bought a brand new ‘Bach 36’ setup from Doug Bert which was the VNY8” bell, gold brass X tuning slide, straight neckpipe and standard T25 slide. I much preferred how the T25 slide accessed the upper range, and it felt a little more what I was used to being primarily a small bore player. It played better as a straight horn vs the valve. It was a great horn and played with a lot of depth, but ultimately I found it too close to my MD+ so I traded the bell and TS back for my current setup, a 7YM bell and standard tuning slide.

It’s been hard where I live in Australia finding different components to easily try out, so it’s been a lot of trial and error! Currently wanting to try it with a large bore slide and perhaps the standard rotor. It can be a super versatile horn for sure!

I have a .525 7GM8, T25, TS, Rotor. I bought it in 2016 and absolutely love it.