I recently bought a mid-70s Bach 50B to have a more complex sound than my Yamaha 613G, which I purchased years ago as a recommended bass bone for a tenor player: Relatively easy to adapt to.

While it IS very easy to play, it kind of lacks the grandfatherly character I associate with a symphonic bass trombone sound, and so I went in search of a not-too-ridiculously priced 2nd bass bone, and the Bach 50B came up for sale!

As between the two, I would describe the sound of the Yamaha as a rectangle turned on its side: not so deep, broader, more of the sound coming back to me, and the Bach is a rectangle turned on its end: super projecting, tons of lower overtones, and for whatever reason, seems to want just one embouchure setting/airstream to really sing, i.e., less foregiving of slight enbouchure misplacements, but if placed properly, plays absolutely as loudly and as softly as you could want, doesn't shout like the Yamaha, or struggle with maintaining sound at very low dynamics.

So much more of the Bach's sound is in front of the bell, not behind it, so I'll need to trust what I'm putting out, and not rely on the sound behind the bell, which is super, super dark!

Am I talking gibberish, or is this a common experience?

Yup. Especially compared to those Yamahas.

I’m with you as well. I’ve been playing a 50b for a few years but last night I took a Shires Q36 to trombone choir rehearsal. The sound of the 50b is much darker by a long shot,

A Bach 50 has the best sound out there but just has terrible valves that can’t get with. And every-time I play one with aftermarket valves, it loses something. For me! If I could get by with a single 50B… life would be easy.

I am having little trouble with the stock dependent valves and paddles, the 2nd valve's slide is just so short that finding and the playing a low C and B natural is a pain, but the horn actually responds fine, the sound through the valves is not so different, and it doesn't blow much differently either from the open horn.

This frankly surprises me.

[quote="ZacharyThornton"]A Bach 50 has the best sound out there but just has terrible valves that can’t get with. And every-time I play one with aftermarket valves, it loses something. For me! If I could get by with a single 50B… life would be easy.[/quote]

This is why I got a Bach 50B with Greenhoe valves. And I don't think the horn in this configuration loses a thing.

I have the feeling that the 613G, and most Yamahas that are not Xeno, were built with “Japanese” sound concept in mind, i.e. lighter, thinner, warmer, not as dense, and emphasizing ease of playing. If you can try a 820G/GII or even the 825 back to back with any of the Xeno you will hear and feel the difference.

I had a Yamaha 321 as my 1st Bass. I loved it. Easy to play, for Big Band stuff I could get some edge when needed. Good low range. Played with either a Schilke 58 or 59 depending the piece.

The one Big Band I was playing with was doing a lot of more modern big band charts and I found that a 2nd valve as going to make life easier.

Found a great Bach 50B3. What a sound! but wasn`t happy with the feedback to me . Everything went out front.

But I received tons of complements on the sound

took some getting used to, and finding the right mouthpiece for me

I`ll never buy another bass Trombone.