The Salt Shaker sound!
- NathanSobieralski
- Posts: 226
- Joined: Feb 04, 2024
I thought this deserved its own thread. This was posted a while ago on FB (February) by South Carolina trombonist James Reese. He really captures the spirit of this mute. Other great demos have been done by William Lang (also below), Brad Edwards, Russ Zokaites, and a few others I may have missed. In particular I think the videos by James and William really capture the essence of the mute in their vids.
Id love to see more of these!
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Id love to see more of these!
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- harrisonreed
- Posts: 6479
- Joined: Aug 17, 2018
Digging James Reese on that mute
- NathanSobieralski
- Posts: 226
- Joined: Feb 04, 2024
[quote="harrisonreed"]Digging James Reese on that mute[/quote]
Its really great I agree.
Its really great I agree.
- ghmerrill
- Posts: 2193
- Joined: Apr 02, 2018
The second one doesn't make it sound like a bucket. He just doesn't have it configured right. Putting that felt baffle in completely straight like that leaves it too open. Ya gotta tune it sideways.
- WilliamLang
- Posts: 636
- Joined: Nov 22, 2019
Don't worry - there's a complete review coming soon! That video, like the title says, is placing it on the axis of other practice mutes. You are right though that the felt in sideways does make it sound a lot more like a bucket, and straight in plays with the in-between sound world between bucket and practice mutes. I love the versatility of the Salt Shaker for those reasons.
Also I hope I never try to make YouTuber face again.
Also I hope I never try to make YouTuber face again.
- NathanSobieralski
- Posts: 226
- Joined: Feb 04, 2024
One of the design objectives with this mute was versatility. I have some orchestral player customers who like the mute configured as William has in his vid, as a sort of warm up mute to cut the sound down a bit while playing at home around family, or while back stage before a performance, etc. So many options. :)
- NathanSobieralski
- Posts: 226
- Joined: Feb 04, 2024
[quote="WilliamLang"]Don't worry - there's a complete review coming soon![/quote]
Looking forward to this!
Looking forward to this!
- NathanSobieralski
- Posts: 226
- Joined: Feb 04, 2024
William Lang's review is up! He goes through the mute and describes many of the options, and a few I hadn't thought of!
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- ghmerrill
- Posts: 2193
- Joined: Apr 02, 2018
Yeah, my configuration of it (1st Gen) as a bucket mute -- after much experimentation :lol: -- is the same as recommended here. You can also attenuate that sound by inserting the thick felt at more or less of an angle to get a different degree of a "muffled" bucket, or pushing it further down into the mute body. But overall, just inserting the thick felt as shown seems the best. The rest of my section is really happy with how it sounds on the bass.
- NathanSobieralski
- Posts: 226
- Joined: Feb 04, 2024
[quote="ghmerrill"]Yeah, my configuration of it (1st Gen) as a bucket mute -- after much experimentation :lol: -- is the same as recommended here.[/quote]
Gary, did you ever try using the two thin felts deep into the mute body? Just wondering if that configuration was a part of your experimentation process.
Gary, did you ever try using the two thin felts deep into the mute body? Just wondering if that configuration was a part of your experimentation process.
- ghmerrill
- Posts: 2193
- Joined: Apr 02, 2018
Yes, I did. With some of these combinations it's difficult to tell if there are any (or any significant) differences compared to other combinations. Sometimes you just get toss-ups. And it also really depends on the sound that YOU are looking for. So I don't remember why I chose the single thick pad over the two thin ones. Possibly just because I felt I was getting the same result (or close to it), and using the single thick pad was easier.
I also think it needs to be conceded that you won't get exactly the same sound out of the Salt Shaker that you will out of a (good) genuine bucket mute. I think there's a certain "resonance" that the bucket provides that the Salt Shaker can't, simply as a matter of the physics. The Salt Shaker isn't devoid of resonance, but it's a bit different. At least to my ear. So some people, for at least some circumstances, may reasonably prefer a (good -- not crappy or mediocre) true bucket mute to the Salt Shaker. I'm not one of those people -- possibly because I won't encounter circumstances where it will matter. So for me the Salt Shaker is a wonderful solution, and I can play all day without even knowing it's there -- which can itself be a problem when you go to put the horn back on the stand. :roll:
I also think it needs to be conceded that you won't get exactly the same sound out of the Salt Shaker that you will out of a (good) genuine bucket mute. I think there's a certain "resonance" that the bucket provides that the Salt Shaker can't, simply as a matter of the physics. The Salt Shaker isn't devoid of resonance, but it's a bit different. At least to my ear. So some people, for at least some circumstances, may reasonably prefer a (good -- not crappy or mediocre) true bucket mute to the Salt Shaker. I'm not one of those people -- possibly because I won't encounter circumstances where it will matter. So for me the Salt Shaker is a wonderful solution, and I can play all day without even knowing it's there -- which can itself be a problem when you go to put the horn back on the stand. :roll:
- Posaunus
- Posts: 5018
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
[quote="ghmerrill"]I also think it needs to be conceded that you won't get exactly the same sound out of the Salt Shaker that you will out of a (good) genuine bucket mute. I think there's a certain "resonance" that the bucket provides that the Salt Shaker can't, simply as a matter of the physics. The Salt Shaker isn't devoid of resonance, but it's a bit different. At least to my ear. ...[/quote]
True enough - but it's a nice sound - and also "variable," as Will Lang demonstrated. Just as an entire trombone section all playing with SoftTone mutes sounds great, I'm confident that a full section playing Salt Shakers would be similarly sonorous.
:horror:
True enough - but it's a nice sound - and also "variable," as Will Lang demonstrated. Just as an entire trombone section all playing with SoftTone mutes sounds great, I'm confident that a full section playing Salt Shakers would be similarly sonorous.
So for me the Salt Shaker is a wonderful solution, and I can play all day without even knowing it's there -- which can itself be a problem when you go to put the horn back on the stand. :roll:
:horror:
- WGWTR180
- Posts: 2152
- Joined: Sep 04, 2019
Trombone sound has changed through the years with the new instruments and mouthpieces. It appears as though we’re now settling for different mute sounds now. Oh well.
- ghmerrill
- Posts: 2193
- Joined: Apr 02, 2018
[quote="WGWTR180"]Trombone sound has changed through the years with the new instruments and mouthpieces. It appears as though we’re now settling for different mute sounds now. Oh well.[/quote]
I don't think "settling" is the most accurate description of the change. In fact, you could turn that perspective around and say that in prior years we had to "settle" on what was available at that point. Now we have more choices.
I don't think "settling" is the most accurate description of the change. In fact, you could turn that perspective around and say that in prior years we had to "settle" on what was available at that point. Now we have more choices.
- WGWTR180
- Posts: 2152
- Joined: Sep 04, 2019
[quote="ghmerrill"]<QUOTE author="WGWTR180" post_id="282722" time="1754258566" user_id="7573">
Trombone sound has changed through the years with the new instruments and mouthpieces. It appears as though we’re now settling for different mute sounds now. Oh well.[/quote]
I don't think "settling" is the most accurate description of the change. In fact, you could turn that perspective around and say that in prior years we had to "settle" on what was available at that point. Now we have more choices.
</QUOTE>
If you say so.
Trombone sound has changed through the years with the new instruments and mouthpieces. It appears as though we’re now settling for different mute sounds now. Oh well.[/quote]
I don't think "settling" is the most accurate description of the change. In fact, you could turn that perspective around and say that in prior years we had to "settle" on what was available at that point. Now we have more choices.
</QUOTE>
If you say so.
- ghmerrill
- Posts: 2193
- Joined: Apr 02, 2018
[quote="WGWTR180"]<QUOTE author="ghmerrill" post_id="282735" time="1754266091" user_id="2941">
I don't think "settling" is the most accurate description of the change. In fact, you could turn that perspective around and say that in prior years we had to "settle" on what was available at that point. Now we have more choices.[/quote]
If you say so.
</QUOTE>
In that case, I do. :)
I don't think "settling" is the most accurate description of the change. In fact, you could turn that perspective around and say that in prior years we had to "settle" on what was available at that point. Now we have more choices.[/quote]
If you say so.
</QUOTE>
In that case, I do. :)
- WGWTR180
- Posts: 2152
- Joined: Sep 04, 2019
[quote="ghmerrill"]<QUOTE author="WGWTR180" post_id="282737" time="1754267853" user_id="7573">
If you say so.[/quote]
In that case, I do. :)
</QUOTE>
Let me put it this way. If the new mutes don't sound like what they should sound like then players are settling for something that possibly just makes their lives easier. I haven't tested this particular mute but I've heard some demos of players, good players, demonstrating the different mute sounds on various new products. I'll focus on 1 mute-the bucket. I have not heard any of the new offerings that sound like a true bucket. Sorry but not even close. But if one doesn't want to carry a bucket to a gig because it's too big, or for whatever reason, then they are settling for something to make their life easier. I guess it also depends on the level of playing which, on this forum, varies greatly.
If you say so.[/quote]
In that case, I do. :)
</QUOTE>
Let me put it this way. If the new mutes don't sound like what they should sound like then players are settling for something that possibly just makes their lives easier. I haven't tested this particular mute but I've heard some demos of players, good players, demonstrating the different mute sounds on various new products. I'll focus on 1 mute-the bucket. I have not heard any of the new offerings that sound like a true bucket. Sorry but not even close. But if one doesn't want to carry a bucket to a gig because it's too big, or for whatever reason, then they are settling for something to make their life easier. I guess it also depends on the level of playing which, on this forum, varies greatly.
- NathanSobieralski
- Posts: 226
- Joined: Feb 04, 2024
Here is Russ Zokiates using a Salt Shaker on the beginning and end of this rendition of Broken Dreams. He gets a very nice covered sound with his chosen configuration.
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- johntarr
- Posts: 368
- Joined: May 07, 2018
[quote="WGWTR180"]Trombone sound has changed through the years with the new instruments and mouthpieces. It appears as though we’re now settling for different mute sounds now. Oh well.[/quote]
If trombone sounds change, why not have different mute sounds?
If trombone sounds change, why not have different mute sounds?
- WGWTR180
- Posts: 2152
- Joined: Sep 04, 2019
[quote="johntarr"]<QUOTE author="WGWTR180" post_id="282722" time="1754258566" user_id="7573">
Trombone sound has changed through the years with the new instruments and mouthpieces. It appears as though we’re now settling for different mute sounds now. Oh well.[/quote]
If trombone sounds change, why not have different mute sounds?
</QUOTE>
Sure. You do you.
Trombone sound has changed through the years with the new instruments and mouthpieces. It appears as though we’re now settling for different mute sounds now. Oh well.[/quote]
If trombone sounds change, why not have different mute sounds?
</QUOTE>
Sure. You do you.
- NathanSobieralski
- Posts: 226
- Joined: Feb 04, 2024
The Salt Shaker mute for trombone was developed on its own as an offshoot of the trumpet salt shaker (also my design), which was itself a part of a 3 in 1 mute design I did a while back. During development of the trombone version, the trombonists (professionals) who collaborated during the testing phase all stated how great the mute is as a stand in/alternative for bucket mute for many situations. They were all very excited about it, and this is the genesis of the bucket mute comparisons. Its really taken a life of its own since then, many hundreds in the hands of trombonists of all stripes worldwide, many of whom use it for its own unique sound configured to their liking.
- NathanSobieralski
- Posts: 226
- Joined: Feb 04, 2024
James Reese does it again.
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- johntarr
- Posts: 368
- Joined: May 07, 2018
[quote="WGWTR180"]<QUOTE author="johntarr" post_id="283807" time="1755495651" user_id="3233">
If trombone sounds change, why not have different mute sounds?[/quote]
Sure. You do you.
</QUOTE>
Thanks for the encouragement!
If trombone sounds change, why not have different mute sounds?[/quote]
Sure. You do you.
</QUOTE>
Thanks for the encouragement!
- johntarr
- Posts: 368
- Joined: May 07, 2018
[quote="NathanSobieralski"]James Reese does it again.
<FACEBOOK id="772338798847250">[media]https://www.facebook.com/reel/772338798847250</FACEBOOK>[/quote]
Unfortunately the video wouldn’t play on my iPad.
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Unfortunately the video wouldn’t play on my iPad.
- NathanSobieralski
- Posts: 226
- Joined: Feb 04, 2024
That's a bummer! If you are on Facebook search up James Reese, the vid is close to the top of his feed still.
[quote="johntarr"]
Unfortunately the video wouldn’t play on my iPad.[/quote]
[quote="johntarr"]
Unfortunately the video wouldn’t play on my iPad.[/quote]