Gillis #3
- robcat2075
- Posts: 1867
- Joined: Sep 03, 2018
Lo, a portion of Lew Gillis's Etude for Bass Trombone With "F" Attachment #3
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What do you suppose is intended for these grace notes? I see three options...
When I did these etudes in college, i chose one manner and did it and no one complained. But none ever seemed ideal.
What do you suppose was intended? The composer is dead and can not be asked. Although he taught here in Texas I've never encountered a former student of his.
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What do you suppose is intended for these grace notes? I see three options...
- smear them
- legato tongue slur them
- valve slur them
When I did these etudes in college, i chose one manner and did it and no one complained. But none ever seemed ideal.
What do you suppose was intended? The composer is dead and can not be asked. Although he taught here in Texas I've never encountered a former student of his.
- bassboy
- Posts: 88
- Joined: Jan 02, 2019
I always had better luck getting closer to how grace notes like these sound in my head when I would do a quick double-tongue, instead of anything else.
I could obviously be wrong about this next part, but I feel like he put these grace notes in here just because brass players in general would run into similar grace notes in various musical settings and this would give students some exposure beforehand. So maybe not necessarily there for their musical/expressive value. But that's just conjecture.
I could obviously be wrong about this next part, but I feel like he put these grace notes in here just because brass players in general would run into similar grace notes in various musical settings and this would give students some exposure beforehand. So maybe not necessarily there for their musical/expressive value. But that's just conjecture.
- BGuttman
- Posts: 7368
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
For this particular instance I'd do a legato tongue with a short grace note stolen from the previous beat. Other people might place the grace note on the beat so the main note is a little late.
I don't think a portamento or a valve slur really works with any of these.
There are other instances where the grace note would actually steal half the note it attaches to and would be articulated as the companion note is. This is mostly music in the Classical and earlier period. I'm sure Maximilien could better expound on this.
I don't think a portamento or a valve slur really works with any of these.
There are other instances where the grace note would actually steal half the note it attaches to and would be articulated as the companion note is. This is mostly music in the Classical and earlier period. I'm sure Maximilien could better expound on this.
- VJOFan
- Posts: 529
- Joined: Apr 06, 2018
What’s the tempo for this? If it’s not too fast, given the composer is solidly in the mid 20th century but writing what looks like tonal melodies from the romantic/post romantic era, I’d just do the grace notes ala Bordogni: all notes lightly tongued as the sixteenth notes later would be. Rhythmically, as Bruce says above, the grace notes precede the beat.
If it’s faster then maybe it’s a comic effect, but then why not just notate scoops into the main notes?
If it’s faster then maybe it’s a comic effect, but then why not just notate scoops into the main notes?
- robcat2075
- Posts: 1867
- Joined: Sep 03, 2018
[quote="VJOFan"]What’s the tempo for this?[/quote]
The etude is but marked "moderately fast"
In my mind it was sort of an ethnic-modal-klezmer thing... like "Hava Nagila"
I was playing it at about 120
The etude is but marked "moderately fast"
In my mind it was sort of an ethnic-modal-klezmer thing... like "Hava Nagila"
I was playing it at about 120
- robcat2075
- Posts: 1867
- Joined: Sep 03, 2018
[quote="BGuttman"]I don't think a portamento or a valve slur really works with any of these.[/quote]
My argument FOR the valve slur is that this is a book intended to introduce straight trombone players to all the ways the valve can be employed. And... if a trumpet or euphonium were playing such music, a valve slur would not be questioned.
My argument AGAINST the valve slur is that not one of them is marked to be done that way, even though there many indications on the regular notes for when to use the valve and even indications of a regular "alternate" position to abet the use of the valve before or after.
My argument FOR the valve slur is that this is a book intended to introduce straight trombone players to all the ways the valve can be employed. And... if a trumpet or euphonium were playing such music, a valve slur would not be questioned.
My argument AGAINST the valve slur is that not one of them is marked to be done that way, even though there many indications on the regular notes for when to use the valve and even indications of a regular "alternate" position to abet the use of the valve before or after.
- Kbiggs
- Posts: 1768
- Joined: Mar 24, 2018
When I worked through these, I used either a quick single-tongued or a double-tongued grace note. I remember thinking about using the valves for the grace notes, but I don’t remember working them up that way. I don’t see any reason why you couldn’t play them that way. Why not work them up both ways and play them in the way you believe they sound best?
I don’t think they were intended to be played portamento.
As to the timing, they are marked as accacciaturas, not appogiaturas. They have an oblique slash through the flag and stem. I would rob time from the previous note and play the non-grace note on the beat.
I don’t think they were intended to be played portamento.
As to the timing, they are marked as accacciaturas, not appogiaturas. They have an oblique slash through the flag and stem. I would rob time from the previous note and play the non-grace note on the beat.