mouthpiece wiggles
- rmb796
- Posts: 207
- Joined: Sep 05, 2018
Hi
I have one mouthpiece that wiggles in my bach 42 leadpipe. All my other mouthpieces fit fine.
Is there any tricks to getting this one mouthpiece to fit properly with no wiggle?
Thanks
Randy
I have one mouthpiece that wiggles in my bach 42 leadpipe. All my other mouthpieces fit fine.
Is there any tricks to getting this one mouthpiece to fit properly with no wiggle?
Thanks
Randy
- BGuttman
- Posts: 7368
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
Is the one that wiggles a small shank mouthpiece? If so, you can use an adapter.
If the mouthpiece that wiggles is just worn, a few thicknesses of Teflon tape (Plumber's tape) can make it fit better.
If the mouthpiece that wiggles is a Conn Remington, don't bother.
If the mouthpiece that wiggles is just worn, a few thicknesses of Teflon tape (Plumber's tape) can make it fit better.
If the mouthpiece that wiggles is a Conn Remington, don't bother.
- brassmedic
- Posts: 1447
- Joined: Dec 14, 2018
What mouthpiece is it?
- rmb796
- Posts: 207
- Joined: Sep 05, 2018
Hi
I have a mouthpiece that wobbles in my Bach 42. All my other mouthpieces fit fine. It appears (by eye) to be perfectly round and in good shape.
Does anyone have any ideas as to how I can fix the "wobble".
Thanks
Randy
I have a mouthpiece that wobbles in my Bach 42. All my other mouthpieces fit fine. It appears (by eye) to be perfectly round and in good shape.
Does anyone have any ideas as to how I can fix the "wobble".
Thanks
Randy
- rmb796
- Posts: 207
- Joined: Sep 05, 2018
It is a Schilke 51 that was cusom made with a 51 rim and a "4G" cup. I bought it used.
I'll try some plumbers tape , but that doesn't seem like a very permanent solution.
Thanks
I'll try some plumbers tape , but that doesn't seem like a very permanent solution.
Thanks
- mrdeacon
- Posts: 1225
- Joined: May 08, 2018
[quote="rmb796"]Hi
I have a mouthpiece that wobbles in my Bach 42. All my other mouthpieces fit fine. It appears (by eye) to be perfectly round and in good shape.
Does anyone have any ideas as to how I can fix the "wobble".
Thanks
Randy[/quote]
Plumbers tape. Couple wraps around the shank will fix that.
I have a mouthpiece that wobbles in my Bach 42. All my other mouthpieces fit fine. It appears (by eye) to be perfectly round and in good shape.
Does anyone have any ideas as to how I can fix the "wobble".
Thanks
Randy[/quote]
Plumbers tape. Couple wraps around the shank will fix that.
- brassmedic
- Posts: 1447
- Joined: Dec 14, 2018
[quote="rmb796"]It is a Schilke 51 that was cusom made with a 51 rim and a "4G" cup. I bought it used.
I'll try some plumbers tape , but that doesn't seem like a very permanent solution.
Thanks[/quote]
Yeah, Schilke mouthpieces had a weird oversize shank. You could draw a line on the shank with felt pen, then insert it and twist it a bit. Wherever the ink is rubbed off is the high spot, so you could try taking down the high spots with emery cloth. Better to have a tech turn it down on a lathe, though - more accurate.
I'll try some plumbers tape , but that doesn't seem like a very permanent solution.
Thanks[/quote]
Yeah, Schilke mouthpieces had a weird oversize shank. You could draw a line on the shank with felt pen, then insert it and twist it a bit. Wherever the ink is rubbed off is the high spot, so you could try taking down the high spots with emery cloth. Better to have a tech turn it down on a lathe, though - more accurate.
- Danitrb
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Dec 10, 2022
Hi, I'm taking advantage of this old thread to ask a question. I have an alto Shires and the mouthpiece wobbles in the leadpipe (on all 3 leadpipes) and it also doesn't seem to go properly deep. Despite this I like the way it sounds and works for me. The instrument and mouthpiece are really excellent, they just doesn't match perfectly. However I think if it went deeper and was really firm in the leadpipe it would sound much better. Do you suggest taking it (mouthpiece) to a technician and trying to adjust the taper until I find best engagement into the leadpipe?
- harrisonreed
- Posts: 6479
- Joined: Aug 17, 2018
Depending on the thickness of the wall at the exit of the shank, it may not even be possible to taper it down further
- UATrombone
- Posts: 126
- Joined: Sep 15, 2024
[quote="harrisonreed"]Depending on the thickness of the wall at the exit of the shank, it may not even be possible to taper it down further[/quote]
Technically, it's possible, but shank (and backbore, of course) will be shorter after that.
I saw a lot of medium-shank mouthpieces which were "born" as a largebore...
Technically, it's possible, but shank (and backbore, of course) will be shorter after that.
I saw a lot of medium-shank mouthpieces which were "born" as a largebore...
- harrisonreed
- Posts: 6479
- Joined: Aug 17, 2018
[quote="UATrombone"]<QUOTE author="harrisonreed" post_id="276817" time="1748200293" user_id="3642">
Depending on the thickness of the wall at the exit of the shank, it may not even be possible to taper it down further[/quote]
Technically, it's possible, but shank (and backbore, of course) will be shorter after that.
I saw a lot of medium-shank mouthpieces which were "born" as a largebore...
</QUOTE>
Yes, and in that case it won't end up going on any further. It will go in the same distance and the mouthpiece will be shorter. It depends on the internal taper a bit, I guess.
Depending on the thickness of the wall at the exit of the shank, it may not even be possible to taper it down further[/quote]
Technically, it's possible, but shank (and backbore, of course) will be shorter after that.
I saw a lot of medium-shank mouthpieces which were "born" as a largebore...
</QUOTE>
Yes, and in that case it won't end up going on any further. It will go in the same distance and the mouthpiece will be shorter. It depends on the internal taper a bit, I guess.
- muschem
- Posts: 372
- Joined: Jan 17, 2021
Rather than modifying the mouthpiece shank, you could also replace the leadpipe. I really like Brad Close's King 2b pipe at .485" in my Shires alto, and it works great with standard small shank - no wobble.
- Danitrb
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Dec 10, 2022
[quote="muschem"]Rather than modifying the mouthpiece shank, you could also replace the leadpipe. I really like Brad Close's King 2b pipe at .485" in my Shires alto, and it works great with standard small shank - no wobble.[/quote]
Thanks for your answers. So, another question. Why another .485 leadpipe works fine with no wobble and Shires doesn't work (in this sense)?
Thanks for your answers. So, another question. Why another .485 leadpipe works fine with no wobble and Shires doesn't work (in this sense)?
- harrisonreed
- Posts: 6479
- Joined: Aug 17, 2018
[quote="Danitrb"]<QUOTE author="muschem" post_id="276834" time="1748209014" user_id="11185">
Rather than modifying the mouthpiece shank, you could also replace the leadpipe. I really like Brad Close's King 2b pipe at .485" in my Shires alto, and it works great with standard small shank - no wobble.[/quote]
Thanks for your answers. So, another question. Why another .485 leadpipe works fine with no wobble and Shires doesn't work (in this sense)?
</QUOTE>
Well is it the leadpipe or the mouthpiece? Does the mouthpiece wiggle in a different small bore instrument?
Rather than modifying the mouthpiece shank, you could also replace the leadpipe. I really like Brad Close's King 2b pipe at .485" in my Shires alto, and it works great with standard small shank - no wobble.[/quote]
Thanks for your answers. So, another question. Why another .485 leadpipe works fine with no wobble and Shires doesn't work (in this sense)?
</QUOTE>
Well is it the leadpipe or the mouthpiece? Does the mouthpiece wiggle in a different small bore instrument?
- Danitrb
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Dec 10, 2022
[quote="harrisonreed"]<QUOTE author="UATrombone" post_id="276830" time="1748208261" user_id="18535">
Technically, it's possible, but shank (and backbore, of course) will be shorter after that.
I saw a lot of medium-shank mouthpieces which were "born" as a largebore...[/quote]
Yes, and in that case it won't end up going on any further. It will go in the same distance and the mouthpiece will be shorter. It depends on the internal taper a bit, I guess.
</QUOTE>
In my case I see the mouthpiece could be deeper in the leadpipe withouth problem. What advantages could I feel in playing if I do this ?
Technically, it's possible, but shank (and backbore, of course) will be shorter after that.
I saw a lot of medium-shank mouthpieces which were "born" as a largebore...[/quote]
Yes, and in that case it won't end up going on any further. It will go in the same distance and the mouthpiece will be shorter. It depends on the internal taper a bit, I guess.
</QUOTE>
In my case I see the mouthpiece could be deeper in the leadpipe withouth problem. What advantages could I feel in playing if I do this ?
- Danitrb
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Dec 10, 2022
[quote="harrisonreed"]<QUOTE author="Danitrb" post_id="276836" time="1748209986" user_id="16002">
Thanks for your answers. So, another question. Why another .485 leadpipe works fine with no wobble and Shires doesn't work (in this sense)?[/quote]
Well is it the leadpipe or the mouthpiece? Does the mouthpiece wiggle in a different small bore instrument?
</QUOTE>
I have to say this mouthpiece I use it is not originally designed for alto, but for me works great on alto so I play on it. It is essentially 12C cup underpart with large rim. I tried it occasionally times in couple of different small tenors and bass trumpet and it fits precisely in the receivers. But my plan it is to use it only on alto or bass trumpet. I would use 6 1/2 underpart on small Bore.
Thanks for your answers. So, another question. Why another .485 leadpipe works fine with no wobble and Shires doesn't work (in this sense)?[/quote]
Well is it the leadpipe or the mouthpiece? Does the mouthpiece wiggle in a different small bore instrument?
</QUOTE>
I have to say this mouthpiece I use it is not originally designed for alto, but for me works great on alto so I play on it. It is essentially 12C cup underpart with large rim. I tried it occasionally times in couple of different small tenors and bass trumpet and it fits precisely in the receivers. But my plan it is to use it only on alto or bass trumpet. I would use 6 1/2 underpart on small Bore.
- harrisonreed
- Posts: 6479
- Joined: Aug 17, 2018
You need to know if it is a leadpipe or mouthpiece problem before you start making changes. Sounds like the shank is too big if it's an issue with all three leadpipes.
- hornbuilder
- Posts: 1384
- Joined: May 02, 2018
Adjusting the taper profile of a mouthpiece does not change the length of the piece, if it is done properly.
- Doug_Elliott
- Posts: 4155
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
It is not uncommon for either receivers or mouthpieces to have incorrect/sloppy tapers.
- Danitrb
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Dec 10, 2022
[quote="harrisonreed"]You need to know if it is a leadpipe or mouthpiece problem before you start making changes. Sounds like the shank is too big if it's an issue with all three leadpipes.[/quote]
Yes , this is also my conclusion.
Yes , this is also my conclusion.
- harrisonreed
- Posts: 6479
- Joined: Aug 17, 2018
[quote="hornbuilder"]Adjusting the taper profile of a mouthpiece does not change the length of the piece, if it is done properly.[/quote]
This is true, if the taper issue makes the mouthpiece too wide at the fat end of the shank. ie if the tip is wobbling inside the leadpipe.
If the mouthpiece is too wide at the very very tip of the shank (wobble is further up the shank), and that is why it's not going in all the way, and there is no wall to work with at the end, then you'd be affecting the length. You can taper from that point all you want but it's going to still be too wide and just make the problem worse.
The suggestion to use marker on the shank is a good one, to see where the issue is.
This is true, if the taper issue makes the mouthpiece too wide at the fat end of the shank. ie if the tip is wobbling inside the leadpipe.
If the mouthpiece is too wide at the very very tip of the shank (wobble is further up the shank), and that is why it's not going in all the way, and there is no wall to work with at the end, then you'd be affecting the length. You can taper from that point all you want but it's going to still be too wide and just make the problem worse.
The suggestion to use marker on the shank is a good one, to see where the issue is.
- hornbuilder
- Posts: 1384
- Joined: May 02, 2018
, and there is no wall to work with at the end, then you'd be affecting the length. You can taper from that point all you want but it's going to still be too wide and just make the problem worse
Having actually done quite a bit of this sort of work, the truth is it usually takes very little material removal to correct the issue. I have never had to shorten a mouthpiece
- JohnL
- Posts: 2529
- Joined: Mar 23, 2018
Time to ask the question: have you tried a standard small shank Bach mouthpiece in the Shires alto leadpipes? Does that combination produce a wobble?
If it were me, I would want to figure out which element of the system (mouthpiece shank or leadpipes) was non-standard and alter it to standard. That way I'd be less likely to have to do more mods down the road.
If it were me, I would want to figure out which element of the system (mouthpiece shank or leadpipes) was non-standard and alter it to standard. That way I'd be less likely to have to do more mods down the road.
- Danitrb
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Dec 10, 2022
[quote="JohnL"]Time to ask the question: have you tried a standard small shank Bach mouthpiece in the Shires alto leadpipes? Does that combination produce a wobble?
If it were me, I would want to figure out which element of the system (mouthpiece shank or leadpipes) was non-standard and alter it to standard. That way I'd be less likely to have to do more mods down the road.[/quote]
I think Shires leadpipes are well made. As I said I tried my mouthpiece occasionally in small bore tenor and was fine, just too small for my sound concept (I just tried for curiosity). I also tried in other altos like Yamaha, Conn and it was the same: it doesn't fits very well in the receivers. I like it but it wobble in the leadpipe. I didn't try small Bach mouthpiece because they don't have possibility to have modular system or different rim/cup combinations. I think altos have specific bore (in fact almost every alto has different bore compare to another), so mouthpiece shank should be adapted to leadpipe . Thank for your answer and I am always open to new suggestions. Maybe I will have the opportunity in the next weeks to go to technician and try to adjust slightly the shank. I will let you know. My purpose is to stop this wobbling, at least.
If it were me, I would want to figure out which element of the system (mouthpiece shank or leadpipes) was non-standard and alter it to standard. That way I'd be less likely to have to do more mods down the road.[/quote]
I think Shires leadpipes are well made. As I said I tried my mouthpiece occasionally in small bore tenor and was fine, just too small for my sound concept (I just tried for curiosity). I also tried in other altos like Yamaha, Conn and it was the same: it doesn't fits very well in the receivers. I like it but it wobble in the leadpipe. I didn't try small Bach mouthpiece because they don't have possibility to have modular system or different rim/cup combinations. I think altos have specific bore (in fact almost every alto has different bore compare to another), so mouthpiece shank should be adapted to leadpipe . Thank for your answer and I am always open to new suggestions. Maybe I will have the opportunity in the next weeks to go to technician and try to adjust slightly the shank. I will let you know. My purpose is to stop this wobbling, at least.