Williams Experts...help!
- tskeldon
- Posts: 106
- Joined: Jul 01, 2018
Hello,
Can those of you who are knowledgeable Williams enthusiasts advise me as to what the silver parts of a Donelson Williams slide hand hold (and the lower ferrule on the second bell brace) are made of?
Are they solid nickel/silver, or are they brass that has been plated with nickel/silver; due to the color, they could even be lightly chromed? Please advise. Thanks!
Tim
Can those of you who are knowledgeable Williams enthusiasts advise me as to what the silver parts of a Donelson Williams slide hand hold (and the lower ferrule on the second bell brace) are made of?
Are they solid nickel/silver, or are they brass that has been plated with nickel/silver; due to the color, they could even be lightly chromed? Please advise. Thanks!
Tim
- Doug_Elliott
- Posts: 4155
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
I think the originals and the Donelson ones both had a sandblasted surface with chrome plating. But it might be nickel plating. I can probably find out if nobody here actually knows.
- baileyman
- Posts: 1169
- Joined: Mar 24, 2018
The pics on this other post seem to indicate plated brass.
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- mrdeacon
- Posts: 1225
- Joined: May 08, 2018
To my eyes it looks brass plated with chrome...
A friend has a Burbank Williams 6 and the silver colored surface is flaking in the same way my Holton TR185 cork barrels were flaking. Holton large bore tenor and bass cork barrels were all brass plated with chrome. The Williams seems to have a much thinner layer of chrome then the Holtons do.
A friend has a Burbank Williams 6 and the silver colored surface is flaking in the same way my Holton TR185 cork barrels were flaking. Holton large bore tenor and bass cork barrels were all brass plated with chrome. The Williams seems to have a much thinner layer of chrome then the Holtons do.
- tskeldon
- Posts: 106
- Joined: Jul 01, 2018
Hi guys!
Thanks for your replies. My eyes incline me to agree with mrdeacon. The color has the cast of chrome, but without the depth of reflectivity that might come from heavier plating.
Doug's suspicions ring true also. There seems to be several instruments around with what appear to be sand-blasted grips; maybe the chrome plating has just been stripped off to reveal the blasted 'solid' nickel underneath.
Thanks guys for your thoughts!
Tim
Thanks for your replies. My eyes incline me to agree with mrdeacon. The color has the cast of chrome, but without the depth of reflectivity that might come from heavier plating.
Doug's suspicions ring true also. There seems to be several instruments around with what appear to be sand-blasted grips; maybe the chrome plating has just been stripped off to reveal the blasted 'solid' nickel underneath.
Thanks guys for your thoughts!
Tim
- DaveAshley
- Posts: 240
- Joined: Aug 01, 2018
I've been told by a very trustworthy source that it's "automotive chrome" (whatever that is) over blasted brass.
- tskeldon
- Posts: 106
- Joined: Jul 01, 2018
Thanks everyone!
I'll let you know when I find out something more conclusive. It may be the case that they vary without regard for era or Williams version or derivative.
Tim
I'll let you know when I find out something more conclusive. It may be the case that they vary without regard for era or Williams version or derivative.
Tim
- Doug_Elliott
- Posts: 4155
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
I know Jay, who made them... I can just ask him if I think of it.
- tskeldon
- Posts: 106
- Joined: Jul 01, 2018
Hi Guys!
Wow! That would be great Doug. Thanks in advance even if you don't get around to it. Not knowing has caused me to do a lot of research (not the least of it on this site), and resulted in me knowing a lot more for being far better advised, but ironically, somehow ending up with far more questions as a result. I'll be contacting you soon to get some mouthpiece advice for the Model 4. I'm wondering if they 'play bigger' than the are, if that means that they can handle more mouthpiece. Exciting experiments coming up!
Tim
Wow! That would be great Doug. Thanks in advance even if you don't get around to it. Not knowing has caused me to do a lot of research (not the least of it on this site), and resulted in me knowing a lot more for being far better advised, but ironically, somehow ending up with far more questions as a result. I'll be contacting you soon to get some mouthpiece advice for the Model 4. I'm wondering if they 'play bigger' than the are, if that means that they can handle more mouthpiece. Exciting experiments coming up!
Tim
- tskeldon
- Posts: 106
- Joined: Jul 01, 2018
Hi everyone,
I was talking to John Duda on another matter, and he said, with regards to what 'Earl' used for the hand holds:
"Some nickel some brass and buckle plated? Seen both!"
That being the case, my understanding is that Jay was faithful to Earls design and construction principles, so this may throw a light on what he used for his Donelson Williams.
I've seen some Earls and some Bobs that looked uniformally matte, or blasted instead of shiney, and the ones that seem to loose plating always seem to be the shiny ones.
I wonder if the matte ones were made of solid nickel and were blasted, while the brass ones were plated. Does anyone know if theirs came from the shop with a silver blasted matte finish? Is it authentic Williams kit?
I hate to bother the 2 Johns with even more trivial Williams questions (when they could both be working on horns for us, LOL); they are both so generous with their knowledge and time already.
Maybe a consensus response from other knowledgeable Williams owners with worn handholds can weigh in and shed some light on this. Personally, I like the flat media-blasted look more than my shiny finish.
Tim
I was talking to John Duda on another matter, and he said, with regards to what 'Earl' used for the hand holds:
"Some nickel some brass and buckle plated? Seen both!"
That being the case, my understanding is that Jay was faithful to Earls design and construction principles, so this may throw a light on what he used for his Donelson Williams.
I've seen some Earls and some Bobs that looked uniformally matte, or blasted instead of shiney, and the ones that seem to loose plating always seem to be the shiny ones.
I wonder if the matte ones were made of solid nickel and were blasted, while the brass ones were plated. Does anyone know if theirs came from the shop with a silver blasted matte finish? Is it authentic Williams kit?
I hate to bother the 2 Johns with even more trivial Williams questions (when they could both be working on horns for us, LOL); they are both so generous with their knowledge and time already.
Maybe a consensus response from other knowledgeable Williams owners with worn handholds can weigh in and shed some light on this. Personally, I like the flat media-blasted look more than my shiny finish.
Tim
- Doug_Elliott
- Posts: 4155
- Joined: Mar 22, 2018
I think you're right about the shiny ones losing their plating. Maybe they just had less plating to start with. Noxon told me Earl used multiple layers of chrome to build up the matte finish, and Jay used nickel. But there are several different types on nickel plating.